Revitalization Around The Rock

[newarkdev01]

On a seperate note, I went out to HK last night and they were doing a Burlesque show (bizarre but entertaining), tommorow there is a retro themed party downtown (I hear this is a mustache contest along with it) and Saturday or Sunday is HK's anniversary. I reiterate a point I made earlier, I wish Hockey season was year round 'cause I think people would love some of the stuff that happens in the offseason.

[ThreeCups]

Once this Kovy deal is finalized, they should immediately begin sculpting an enormous statue of Lou to put in Championship Plaza next to the existing one...

Edited July 30, 2010 by ThreeCups

[newarkdev01]

Once this Kovy deal is finalized, they should immediately begin sculpting an enormous statue of Lou to put in Championship Plaza next to the existing one...

Should it have a quote, "Don't worry about my Cap!"

[DaneykoIsGod]

Should it have a quote, "Don't worry about my Cap!"

Or "This is GM."

[Masked Fan]

Or "This is GM."

niiiiiice

[newarkdev01]

So I got in invight for a public meeting on triangle park next week....that should be interesting.

[devlman]

I dont get the reasoning for a park. Why take away thriving business with the Edison lots to put a park that will attract the homeless? Maybe so fans can have a meeting place before games? Nah, Championship Plaza fulfills that role. Maybe its so fans can watch games from the outside? Nah, the partitioned screen isnt that viewable from up-close.

[newarkdev01]

I think it's primarily to force verticle building by removing surface lot parking.

[devlman]

I think it's primarily to force verticle building by removing surface lot parking.

To force verticle building? Why would they want a tall structure blocking the vid screens at the Pru?

[The Rock 07]

To force verticle building? Why would they want a tall structure blocking the vid screens at the Pru?

Well the park would be in front of the screen and then new towers along the sides.

[devlman]

Well the park would be in front of the screen and then new towers along the sides.

Oh...but again, there needs to be a park to attract vertical development? The parking lots seem to be more practical for that purpose.

[NewarkDevil5]

Oh...but again, there needs to be a park to attract vertical development? The parking lots seem to be more practical for that purpose.

Surface lots are a barrier to development, not an aid. They are considered a development dead zone. Any urban planner will tell you that if people have to walk more than a certain number of feet between storefronts in an urban downtown it kills the development of the area. One exception to this is park space which not only increases surrounding property values (if properly upkept) but it also extends the distances people are willing to walk by providing shade and areas to sit and rest. The ideal situation would be for the city to build the Triangle Park over an underground parking lot along the same model as Military Park. This would be a best of both worlds scenario in which the benefits of having the parking there would be realized without the negative effects of a long gap in development. As far as the homeless issue is concerned, I've spent lots of time in Military Park and PSEG Plaza and Washington Park and not been accosted by anyone. The most I've dealt with homeless people or panhandlers has been in and around Penn Station and on certain streets. Does it bother you that homeless people use parks? They are just as much a part of the public for whom those parks are meant to serve as you. Many of them are veterans who have given limbs to the service of this country. Some of them are lowlifes. Public benefit is meant for just that, public. Whether that means rich public or starving public.

[DaneykoIsGod]

FWIW, this is the conceptual drawing of the area included in the Inaugural Season STH brochure.

Looks like a lot of vertical development on either side.

[newarkdev01]

Well Edison was on board with a hotel 3 years ago but they weren't able to get the financing package together and they pretty much lost their battle with IronMountain. I would like to see the extension of the walkway over 21 and into 21 like Edison was showing on their pitch for the tower.

[devlman]

Surface lots are a barrier to development, not an aid. They are considered a development dead zone. Any urban planner will tell you that if people have to walk more than a certain number of feet between storefronts in an urban downtown it kills the development of the area. One exception to this is park space which not only increases surrounding property values (if properly upkept) but it also extends the distances people are willing to walk by providing shade and areas to sit and rest. The ideal situation would be for the city to build the Triangle Park over an underground parking lot along the same model as Military Park. This would be a best of both worlds scenario in which the benefits of having the parking there would be realized without the negative effects of a long gap in development. As far as the homeless issue is concerned, I've spent lots of time in Military Park and PSEG Plaza and Washington Park and not been accosted by anyone. The most I've dealt with homeless people or panhandlers has been in and around Penn Station and on certain streets. Does it bother you that homeless people use parks? They are just as much a part of the public for whom those parks are meant to serve as you. Many of them are veterans who have given limbs to the service of this country. Some of them are lowlifes. Public benefit is meant for just that, public. Whether that means rich public or starving public.

Military Park is full of homeless people. They may not bother you but its not attractive. I am not attacking the homeless, they have every right to use the parks, and they will. Just wont add to the value of the area.

The lot underneath the park sounds like a good suggestion. Parking lots may be a detriment to walking but those lots do good business and it would be a shame to pack them up just to slightly appease one's walking habits....it is directly across from an arena, afterall.

Edited August 11, 2010 by devlman

[newarkdev01]

Military Park is full of homeless people. They may not bother you but its not attractive. I am not attacking the homeless, they have every right to use the parks, and they will. Just wont add to the value of the area.

The lot underneath the park sounds like a good suggestion. Parking lots may be a detriment to walking but those lots do good business and it would be a shame to pack them up just to slightly appease one's walking habits....it is directly across from an arena, afterall.

Devlman,

The problem is parking lots dont create rateables like a 10 story buildnig does and Newark neads desperately to increase it's tax base. Secondly desity is huge in cities, it enables a greater amount of 1rst floor retail and contributes more revenue for the city and land owners. Newark is not the subburbs and for a city suface lot parking is like death, it chews up potential rateables. As for the homeless, when is the last time you were bombarded by homeless people over in championship plaza? Milatary park and PSEG plaza attract vagrants because the buss routes are there.

Edited August 11, 2010 by newarkdev01

[NewarkDevil5]

Military Park is full of homeless people. They may not bother you but its not attractive. I am not attacking the homeless, they have every right to use the parks, and they will. Just wont add to the value of the area.

The lot underneath the park sounds like a good suggestion. Parking lots may be a detriment to walking but those lots do good business and it would be a shame to pack them up just to slightly appease one's walking habits....it is directly across from an arena, afterall.

Its not a question of "appeasing one's walking habits." The crux of urban development is the direction and volume of foot traffic. If foot traffic is steered one way versus another one area will develop and the other will languish. Areas that are heavily broken up by surface level parking lack flow in foot traffic.

[devlman]

Devlman,

The problem is parking lots dont create rateables like a 10 story buildnig does and Newark neads desperately to increase it's tax base. Secondly desity is huge in cities, it enables a greater amount of 1rst floor retail and contributes more revenue for the city and land owners. Newark is not the subburbs and for a city suface lot parking is like death, it chews up potential rateables. As for the homeless, when is the last time you were bombarded by homeless people over in championship plaza? Milatary park and PSEG plaza attract vagrants because the buss routes are there.

Agreed. I just find this theory of how office space development can completely hinge on whether a small park is built adjacent to it a bit odd. Theres not much storefront shopping to be done in the vicinity to begin with so the park's value still is interesting to me.

NewarkDevil5 - I understand that point also of heavy contiguous lot space undermining potential for foot traffic. Thing is, there are about only 2 lots there and no continuous stretch of storefont in the vicinity anyway.

Edited August 11, 2010 by devlman

[NewarkDevil5]

But the continuous stretches of storefront are the end-result goal to create an "entertainment district."

[newarkdev01]

Edison's projects for trying to get their hotel and then their tower and walkway built speak to this subject. Basically you want a vibrant district withj alot of "friction" or density of retail that has a mutually benificial effect on one another. This is the core of what makes a arena successful in fufilling the role of a revitalizer for a neighborhood. I was in DC a few weeks ago and their arena is made to blend into a retail district and enhance it by adding foot traffic. The simple idea is the antithesis of the meadowlands, do not make it easy to leave but rather work towards keeping people later and using mass transportation. Newark does not want surface parking surrounding the arena they want buildings with hotels or office space. If the city has to settle for a parking garage it at least wants retail at the base. The park is not neccesary but it is thought ot be a catalyst to get Edison to do more than just leave the land as a flat lot for parking. What's amazing is Ratnher used this theory in Brooklyn (basically calling surface parking lots blight)to conduct a massive land grab for their project and in the end there will enormous amounts of surface parking there as they slowly (very slowly) build housing next door to Atlantic Yards.

[devlman]

That makes sense for the long-term. And hopefully the park is a catalyst for the Lots to do more with the property. In the mean time, there is a need for parking lots, the city of Newark has no money to even build a park, and there arent many businesses begging for space to set up shop in the vicinity. So, my point is that it would be wise if the park happened years down the road when the economy is better and the demand for office/retail space exists.

[Marv4Life]

That makes sense for the long-term. And hopefully the park is a catalyst for the Lots to do more with the property. In the mean time, there is a need for parking lots, the city of Newark has no money to even build a park, and there arent many businesses begging for space to set up shop in the vicinity. So, my point is that it would be wise if the park happened years down the road when the economy is better and the demand for office/retail space exists.

With mass transit available, there really isn't a real need for lots. They can rip apart the one in front of the big screen and it wouldn't make a difference, just force em to take the train in. This isn't a suburb or the outskirts of downtown.

[El Diablo]

With mass transit available, there really isn't a real need for lots. They can rip apart the one in front of the big screen and it wouldn't make a difference, just force em to take the train in. This isn't a suburb or the outskirts of downtown.

Marv - you are then losing thousands of fans who drive in .. not everyone does mass transit

[The Rock 07]

I guess they'd build some garages which would replace some of the parking and with less parking, people would have to park further away giving more street activity in more parts of downtown. Which makes opening new restaurants/businesses more attractive and helps improve the city.

[newarkdev01]

A nice little plug for squarefoot...

http://www.nj.com/news/index.ssf/2010/09/real_estate_broker_shapes_newa.html