NewarkDevil5 Posted May 18, 2006 Author Share Posted May 18, 2006 Does Berman have a deal with Trenton precluding any other hockey team from playing there? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satans Hockey Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 Does Berman have a deal with Trenton precluding any other hockey team from playing there? I would think so. I mean come on you know he isn't going to let a higher level league play there without a huge fight. Fans would probably go to an AHL game before an ECHL game. They would lose a ton of fans that way especially if the AHL tix were cheaper than the Titans tix. It just doesn't make any business sense to have 2 minor league hockey teams play in the same arena. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyNice Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 I did a cursory search and could not find any info about the Titans lease. However, I think if the Devils want to move to Trenton they will find a way to do it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewarkDevil5 Posted May 19, 2006 Author Share Posted May 19, 2006 I did a cursory search and could not find any info about the Titans lease. However, I think if the Devils want to move to Trenton they will find a way to do it. I'm inclined to agree. Its difficult for a lesser team to block a higher up team from an arena. It'd be the equivalent of the River Rats blocking an NHL team from moving to Albany. Who do you think would win that battle? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdub Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 What about South Mountain? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewarkDevil5 Posted May 19, 2006 Author Share Posted May 19, 2006 South Mountain would essentially be Newark-Lite. At that point you might as well move them to Newark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyFan42 Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 I've never been to South Mountain, but wouldn't they need to redo the place to bring it up to AHL standards? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CRASHER Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 South Mountain sits what maybe a THOUSAND people ?? (well for Albany crowds that could be enough ) SoMo is not the answer here.... Trenton seems the only viable place in NJ that could handle it.... they could always just buy the rights to that arena there Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
PeteyNice Posted May 19, 2006 Share Posted May 19, 2006 They have two years (or more really, they could always work out a new lease in Lowell if they had to) to find a site and build an arena. Trenton's arena is certainly AHL capable and right now seems to be the best option but a lot can happen in two years. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jdub Posted May 20, 2006 Share Posted May 20, 2006 Also Mennan Arena in Morristown... been to a Seton Hall Prep vs. Delbarton game there.. fit 2500... still not enough but how many people would catch an AHL game? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyFan42 Posted May 20, 2006 Share Posted May 20, 2006 The smallest AHL arena is in Binghamton and holds 4,727 for hockey. With the economics of the AHL nowadays, you need to be able to average 3,000 fans a game at the very least, ideally no less than 4,000-4,500. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NewarkDevil5 Posted May 20, 2006 Author Share Posted May 20, 2006 Well Trenton's Sovereign Bank Arena holds 8,100 people for hockey. Thats the only currently built arena in the state that I can think of that seats more than 4,000 outside of Newark and East Rutherford. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ev0lemi Posted May 20, 2006 Share Posted May 20, 2006 Isn't there an ice rink over down the shore on Rt 34 or 33? I remember going there as a kid. i'd be totally happy to convert more of the Cryer fans down there to the right side of the puck. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Puddy Posted May 21, 2006 Share Posted May 21, 2006 Ocean Ice Palace. It's just a rink though, not really built for big crowds. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arctic NRG Posted May 27, 2006 Share Posted May 27, 2006 If they move the Devils' AHL affiliate to New Jersey, why not try Camden and rename the team the "Camden Devils" since it's a high-crime city. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbdf Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 Trenton won't happen, the jersey shore likely will not happen either. If they move the team closer, it's not going to be anywhere within 2 hours drive of Newark - one sure fire way to NOT sell NHL tickets is to have a cheaper competing product within your ticket holder range. Let's see, I can spend $75+ per ticket, plus parking, concessions, etc to go to the new Devils arena, or, I can spend $25 or so for the best seat in the house, with cheaper parking, cheaper concessions and less travel hassel to see an AHL game, then go watch the Devils on TV. What do you think that does to your walk up sales? Trust me folks, NHL teams look for a minimum of 12,000 full season equivalents, 70% of the luxury boxes, and 90% of in-arena advertising, plus an average of 4,000 walk ups (individual game tickets) in order to break even or come close to breaking even. Putting a cheaper alternative too close by wipes out those 4,000 walk ups. Say it halves it on you, 2,000 individual game tickets X 41 games X $50 = Patrick Elias' salary last season. NHL rules would cause a fat payment to the Flyers if they put it too close to Philly, Trenton's owners, if they had any business smarts whatsoever (and judging by their success, I'm guessing they do), I'm guessing has a clause in their lease preventing competing product in their rink, and you can't get too close to Newark for fear of cannibalizing your own sales. Lakewood was probably about right for staying out of Flyer territory and just being on the cusp of cannibalizing your own. Toms River really offers nothing - basically no real way of getting there from anyplace else in the state other than the Pkwy/Rt 9 (north/south) at least lakewood had 195 (east west) as well as 9, so you'd be marketing to Toms River residents only and hoping for 4,000 season ticket holders there (and, very limited business customers for buying the lux boxes which you'd obviously have if you built a new building similar to trenton). Would you build a $50 million stadium in Toms River? Think about it. Is there enough development, business, access via major roads? If there is, they're hiding it under a rock someplace. Woodbridge or New Brunswick give you fans, businesses and access via many highways/mass transit, but also would cannibalize your walk up crowd in Newark pretty badly. If they move closer, it will be to someplace like southern NY (poughkeepsie or newburg? white plains is too close to NYC and would likely cause payment to NYR/Isles) or eastern PA (scranton is probably too close to wilkes barre, but is a college town so could make a good match - Allentown/Bethleham area maybe-is there anything left there since the steel mills shut down? Anything around Stroudsville, that's just over the border and on rte 80 i think). Like I said, someplace more like 2hours away from Newark, but not infringing on other existin NHL/AHL or ECHL territory either. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RowdyFan42 Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 One thing that has to be considered is that proximity to NHL clubs is irrelevant. As far as I know, NHL teams have no say over whether teams in other leagues set up shop in their area. I believe the AHL's protected radius (for lack of a better term) is 40 miles (the NHL's is 75, is it not?); obviously you still have to worry about Philly because of the Phantoms, but the Rangers and Isles don't matter unless you're getting close to Hartford and Bridgeport. One minor point: The team in Wilkes-Barre actually calls themselves Wilkes-Barre/Scranton (and the baseball team is Scranton/Wilkes-Barre), so Scranton is definitely out of the question. What about Atlantic City? I've never been in Boardwalk Hall, but the ECHL Bullies played there as recently as last year, so it can't be too bad of a venue. I know the local owners couldn't make it work, but maybe if the Devils were in there running things it would be different. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbdf Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 A/C didn't have enough permanent residents to fill hockey rink - they were relying on casino support, but people going to the casinos had no desire to see AA hockey. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Satans Hockey Posted June 15, 2006 Share Posted June 15, 2006 (edited) What about Atlantic City? I've never been in Boardwalk Hall, but the ECHL Bullies played there as recently as last year, so it can't be too bad of a venue. I know the local owners couldn't make it work, but maybe if the Devils were in there running things it would be different. I really don't think it would be any different. I have been to a lot of Bullies games and one time I went to a PLAYOFF GAME there and there was roughly about 50 people. The most crowded I have ever seen that place was when the Bullies won in 03 and it was still maybe 3,000 people but that place can hold almost 10,000. There has been talk about getting a team back in A.C. in the ECHL but I just don't see it happening. The fan base just isn't there. Edited June 15, 2006 by Satans Hockey Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vadvlfan Posted July 9, 2006 Share Posted July 9, 2006 Trenton would be the obvlous/ and best choice because you're not reinventing the wheel. Ownership has already sold hockey in the area. Hopefully you can sell season tix right away. You would have to again sell the sport in A.C. Here's the rub. The mayor of norfolk Va. wouldn't give the (echl) admirals a lease unless they sold the team, and brought in a AHL team. Norfolk already has the triple A "Tides" *(Mets-farmteam) The echl admirals sold out often in a 9K seat arena. (Scope) Why?- $5 seats. Family's went kids loved the excitement. When the AHL came into town, tix prices shot up, and now they have 1800 -3500 per game. Although not guarenteed a success, Trenton is the best place because its hockey ready, and down the street from the phantoms. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aylbert Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 If they move the Devils' AHL affiliate to New Jersey, why not try Camden and rename the team the "Camden Devils" since it's a high-crime city. Camden is right across the river from Philly... Most people consider the concert venue their to be Philly (the t-shirts typially list philly; not camden.). NOBODY would go to a Camden for a Devils-affiliated hockey game. ever. You can see the Flyers stadium from Camden. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyk Posted July 10, 2006 Share Posted July 10, 2006 I think Mr. NRG was making fun of a part of NJ. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arctic NRG Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 (edited) Well I live in Massachusetts. I didn't say I knew where in Jersey Camden is. I just know it's high-crime coz I remember seeing a documentry of it on Geraldo At Large. I'm only joking around. Nothing to take too seriously. Edited July 12, 2006 by Arctic NRG Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sammyk Posted July 12, 2006 Share Posted July 12, 2006 No reason to make fun! Hey Mr eNeRGy, do you have a picture of the Lowell skyline? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arctic NRG Posted August 2, 2006 Share Posted August 2, 2006 I can't say there's many good pictures of Lowell. But here's what I found from Google. And uh... here's a painting of the city. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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