Students Kicked Off Campus for Wearing American Flag Tees

[squishyx]

Neither is Cinco De Mayo celebrated here, other than by bars. It's barely celebrated in Mexico.

So if I chose to feel it's very important when I'm in Japan I would be, apparently, justified in feeling antagonized by all displays of Japanese pride that day.

You don't seem to think it would be unreasonable for the Mexican groups to be offended by the American flag, so I feel you're in agreement that they should be offended. You can clarify if you don't think they should be offended.

Yea, didn't say any of that. Tired of you making up arguments, tell the wall I said hi.

[devilsfan26]

And that matters why exactly?

There has been much more racism displayed toward Mexicans than Irish people recently, and there is a lower percentage of Irish-Americans who are live a more Irish lifestyle than American than there are Mexican-Americans who live more Mexican than American. Of course Mexicans are more likely to be offended.

I don't think that's what is being shown since his example wasn't very analogous. He would need to make in a Devils-Ranger game at the Pru Center for it to make sense, but with more Ranger fans than Devil fans at the game. Then make it during the game the Rangers clinched the playoff win over the Devils so that the Ranger fans are celebrating.

Then it would be that the Ranger fans being antagonized is incidental to the fact a person wanted to wear a jersey supporting their team. The goal isn't to antagonize, or else they would have worn a Messier sucks shirt, but it just happens anyway and that isn't a persons fault or intention.

That is a stretch. People wear Devils jerseys at every Devils game. I very highly doubt these kids wear the American flag every single day. Also sporting events involve the two teams competing with each other. Cinco de Mayo is not the United States vs. Mexico.

[Daniel]

There has been much more racism displayed toward Mexicans than Irish people recently, and there is a lower percentage of Irish-Americans who are live a more Irish lifestyle than American than there are Mexican-Americans who live more Mexican than American. Of course Mexicans are more likely to be offended.

What exactly is an Irish lifestyle?

[devilsfan26]

Neither is Cinco De Mayo celebrated here, other than by bars.

The point is everybody knows about it here. Our Veterans' Day is not common knowledge in Japan. If your example of a Japanese kid in Japan wearing the Japanese flag to school took place at a school that had a large percentage of Americans and everyone was well aware that it was Veterans' Day, then yea it is safe to assume those kids are being antagonistic. If nobody knew it was Veterans' Day then no they are not trying to antagonize.

What exactly is an Irish lifestyle?

I don't really know, I guess it's similar to ours, but that's why they wouldn't get offended.

[thegame346]

Wearing the American flag in the fashion they were is disrespectful to this country. But thats probably a separate debate altogether.

Lets call a spade a spade here, they didn't do this because they love this country, they did it to antagonize. Kids will be kids, they shouldn't have been sent home but lets not turn these guys into patriotic martyrs.

I might agree with you on this but heres the thing... I am not going to based on the fact that I WILL see another countries flag on the fourth of July. If I say anything to the effect that I feel they are antagonizing me I will be branded a poor representative of this country. You sir are being a pacifist. The same attitude that got comedy central to ban thier episode of south park about Mohammed is the same attitude being displayed by this school.... limiting free speech because they are too pussifed and fear reprisal by an individual or group of indivduals.

Cinco De Mayo is a celebration of a Mexican victory over the French. It has nothing to do with American heritage at all so why is it being celebrated in our schools? I am not saying the teens are right for wearing American flag bandanna's and t-shirts but the school is equally wrong for their role.

[devilsfan26]

Cinco De Mayo is a celebration of a Mexican victory over the French. It has nothing to do with American heritage at all so why is it being celebrated in our schools? I am not saying the teens are right for wearing American flag bandanna's and t-shirts but the school is equally wrong for their role.

From what I read I don't think it was an organized celebration by the school. Teachers and students used to wear green on St. Patrick's Day at my schools but it wasn't like there was any official school celebration going on.

[squishyx]

I might agree with you on this but heres the thing... I am not going to based on the fact that I WILL see another countries flag on the fourth of July. If I say anything to the effect that I feel they are antagonizing me I will be branded a poor representative of this country. You sir are being a pacifist. The same attitude that got comedy central to ban thier episode of south park about Mohammed is the same attitude being displayed by this school.... limiting free speech because they are too pussifed and fear reprisal by an individual or group of indivduals.

Cinco De Mayo is a celebration of a Mexican victory over the French. It has nothing to do with American heritage at all so why is it being celebrated in our schools? I am not saying the teens are right for wearing American flag bandanna's and t-shirts but the school is equally wrong for their role.

I said the school was wrong (4th time).

As with D731 you are talking about if you specifically should be offended if someone else does something. That is not something I can speak for, nor do I have any desire too.

I am speaking for the intent of the group, what are they trying to do? In this case I think those kids were trying to stir the pot, not wear the flag as an act of patriotism. I think these kids have every right under the 1st amendment to wear the shirts and bandanna's (although they are disrespecting it) and thus should not have been sent home. But they are no patriots.

I also think this has no parallels to South Park because I think the intent of the kids was to take a subtle jab at Hispanics, while the executives at CC's intent was to protect their employees. Of course this is just my opinion, I am not these kids, nor executives at comedy central, usually that disclaimer goes without saying but apparently it's been an issue today to make it clear that you are not in fact an entire group of people.

Edited May 7, 2010 by squishyx

[thegame346]

I said the school was wrong (4th time).

As with D731 you are talking about if you specifically should be offended if someone else does something. That is not something I can speak for, nor do I have any desire too.

I am speaking for the intent of the group, what are they trying to do? In this case I think those kids were trying to stir the pot, not wear the flag as an act of patriotism. I think these kids have every right under the 1st amendment to wear the shirts and bandanna's (although they are disrespecting it) and thus should not have been sent home. But they are no patriots.

I also think this has no parallels to South Park because I think the intent of the kids was to take a subtle jab at Hispanics, while the executives at CC's intent was to protect their employees. Of course this is just my opinion, I am not these kids, nor executives at comedy central, usually that disclaimer goes without saying but apparently it's been an issue today to make it clear that you are not in fact an entire group of people.

I am not talking about the schools decision to send the kids home. I am talking about before that. The school whether it be the administrators, or the faculty are wrong for favoring one side OR the other. It is either all or none. Either the kids can wear the articles of clothing they want REGARDLESS of the day or they ALL can not. You don't get to pick and choose.... well legally yes they can HOWEVER when you start picking and choosing is when you get situations like this in the first place.

Bottom line is this. The school had the ability before ANY of this happened to decree that NO overt showings in regards to affection for country will be shown. They decided to roll the dice and play the odds. Well they lost and now they are having to go into damage control over this WHOLE issue which has now garnered national media interest. The fault is the schools.

[squishyx]

I am not talking about the schools decision to send the kids home. I am talking about before that. The school whether it be the administrators, or the faculty are wrong for favoring one side OR the other. It is either all or none. Either the kids can wear the articles of clothing they want REGARDLESS of the day or they ALL can not. You don't get to pick and choose.... well legally yes they can HOWEVER when you start picking and choosing is when you get situations like this in the first place.

Bottom line is this. The school had the ability before ANY of this happened to decree that NO overt showings in regards to affection for country will be shown. They decided to roll the dice and play the odds. Well they lost and now they are having to go into damage control over this WHOLE issue which has now garnered national media interest. The fault is the schools.

Ok sure, I'm just not sure why you quoted me though because nothing I said in anyway goes against that. I don't know if the school had an actually policy about clothing but if they don't I agree with you that they should and follow it consistently.

[thegame346]

Ok sure, I'm just not sure why you quoted me though because nothing I said in anyway goes against that. I don't know if the school had an actually policy about clothing but if they don't I agree with you that they should and follow it consistently.

I may have read it one way and you meant it another. A LOT of the way we determine the intent behind conversation is just that... actual verbal conversation. On the internet a lot of good argument gets misconstrued because inflection of voice, conversation pauses, and accentuation of syllables can not be determined.

[Hi, I'm VALUE!]

So squishy, are you saying the school was right?

what I think is more relevant to the school's part of this is that the Mexican kids were likely planning on dealing with this themselves in a more violent means. Assistant Principal probably got the low-down on that and acted to prevent the beatdowns, which is what he should have done all day and all night, and the school board should be ashamed for not backing him.

I'm not going to write the pro-American kids a free pass, because I don't know their actual intent, and unless they have a history of wearing Team AMERICA~! merch all the time, this does seem really fishy. But it's so easy to say "They were trying to start sh!t" when we really don't have any clue.

But two hundred to protest the kids not getting stiffer punishment? Yeah, I'm with Daniel on this one: get over it. There's a whole lot of entitlement going around that school, and I really dislike it. Worry about yourself, revel in your freedom to express your diversity and culture, and don't throw a tantrum when someone else does the same.

[squishyx]

So squishy, are you saying the school was right?

I hate you forever.

[Devils731]

I'm not going to write the pro-American kids a free pass, because I don't know their actual intent, and unless they have a history of wearing Team AMERICA~! merch all the time, this does seem really fishy. But it's so easy to say "They were trying to start sh!t" when we really don't have any clue.

An article that came out today says that at least one of the kids does often wear what he wore that day and they usually have American flags on their backpack.

http://www.gilroydispatch.com/news/265455-american-flag-shirts-ignite-firestorm

Comments left online on the Times and Gilroy Dispatch websites said the boys are often seen with American flag patches on their backpacks, and Maciel said he's worn the T-shirt he wore on Cinco de Mayo many times before.

I guess we can't verify online comments but one of the kids says he wore that shirt before many times, so it's not an unusual thing for him to wear.

Edited May 7, 2010 by Devils731

[Daniel]

I said the school was wrong (4th time).

How on earth can you say the school was right?

[Neutral Zone Trap]

I can't believe this is getting the attention it is.

While US citizens of northern states (whites) might not see it so much, cinco de mayo is very well celebrated in the border states ( I reside in Texas)

731 made the correct point that cinco de mayo and diez y seis are not that much celebrated in Mexico, but much moreso in the border states where the main concentration of Mexican Americans reside.

The point of the issue is this. The school where this happened IS within the borders of the United States of America. May the 5th is a MEXICAN holiday (regardless if it is observed or not in Mexico) For the school to take this action is grounds for a massive lawsuit in denying freedom of speech.

There is no "antagonizing" here. Because this did not happen in Mexico, this happened in the US.

What the school did is illegal, and therefore punishable by whatever the appropriate measures are.

I'll leave you with this, which is very relevant :-

Australian Prime Minister does it again!!

This man should be appointed King of the World. Truer words have never been spoken.

It took a lot of courage for this man to speak what he had to say for the world to hear. The retribution could be phenomenal, but at least he was willing to take a stand on his and Australia’s beliefs.

The Whole world Needs A Leader Like This!

Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks..

Separately, Rudd angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques. Quote:

'IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians. '

'This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom'

'We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society. Learn the language!'

'Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture.'

'We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.'

'This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, 'THE RIGHT TO LEAVE'.'

'If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.'

[Devilish34]

I always thought Cino de mayo was Coronas idea to sell more beer.

So some other kids where offended bc these kids wore clothing with the US flag on it in the US. Really people need to get a life and get over it

[devilsfan26]

I always thought Cino de mayo was Coronas idea to sell more beer.

You call that stuff beer?

[Devilish34]

You call that stuff beer?

No!!!! More like piss

[eaglejelly]

Australian Prime Minister does it again!!

This man should be appointed King of the World. Truer words have never been spoken.

It took a lot of courage for this man to speak what he had to say for the world to hear. The retribution could be phenomenal, but at least he was willing to take a stand on his and Australia’s beliefs.

The Whole world Needs A Leader Like This!

Muslims who want to live under Islamic Sharia law were told on Wednesday to get out of Australia, as the government targeted radicals in a bid to head off potential terror attacks..

Separately, Rudd angered some Australian Muslims on Wednesday by saying he supported spy agencies monitoring the nation's mosques. Quote:

'IMMIGRANTS, NOT AUSTRALIANS, MUST ADAPT. Take It Or Leave It. I am tired of this nation worrying about whether we are offending some individual or their culture. Since the terrorist attacks on Bali, we have experienced a surge in patriotism by the majority of Australians. '

'This culture has been developed over two centuries of struggles, trials and victories by millions of men and women who have sought freedom'

'We speak mainly ENGLISH, not Spanish, Lebanese, Arabic, Chinese, Japanese, Russian, or any other language. Therefore, if you wish to become part of our society. Learn the language!'

'Most Australians believe in God. This is not some Christian, right wing, political push, but a fact, because Christian men and women, on Christian principles, founded this nation, and this is clearly documented. It is certainly appropriate to display it on the walls of our schools. If God offends you, then I suggest you consider another part of the world as your new home, because God is part of our culture.'

'We will accept your beliefs, and will not question why. All we ask is that you accept ours, and live in harmony and peaceful enjoyment with us.'

'This is OUR COUNTRY, OUR LAND, and OUR LIFESTYLE, and we will allow you every opportunity to enjoy all this. But once you are done complaining, whining, and griping about Our Flag, Our Pledge, Our Christian beliefs, or Our Way of Life, I highly encourage you take advantage of one other great Australian freedom, 'THE RIGHT TO LEAVE'.'

'If you aren't happy here then LEAVE. We didn't force you to come here. You asked to be here. So accept the country YOU accepted.'

Did Christian founding fathers bother to adapt to the culture and language of the people who had been living there before they came

[matcat1116]

Did Christian founding fathers bother to adapt to the culture and language of the people who had been living there before they came

If you find it a mistake that they didn't then you should completely agree with the post that you quoted.

Regardless, completely different scenario which is incompatible with the scenario of today. You should be able to figure out why.

[Neutral Zone Trap]

No!!!! More like piss

That would be Bud Light, yuck. I don't know why that is so popular, but each to their own I guess.

I think the German translation for Bud light is "grossbeer" And no, I don't mean a big beer.

[devilsfan26]

That would be Bud Light, yuck. I don't know why that is so popular, but each to their own I guess..

Guess that's what happens when you sacrifice the money you spend on quality and divert it all to advertising.

While we're on the topic, I think this is worth reading.

[Derek21]

How ridiculous. I didn't realize it was offensive to wear our flag. This is America last I checked. Finally, Cinco de Mayo is just another poor excuse to get wasted.

[thegame346]

Ya know I don't want to sound all conspiracy theorist here but I think there may be a state, and federal movement purposely singling out those who display their patriotism.

Think about it for a second. We are STILL in an economic downturn and NOTHING motivates people to go out and buy sh!t that is patriotic in nature more then stories of patriotism being challenged. If enough patriotism is squelched it could cause an upraor and thus make people feel they need to go out and buy American sh!t in order to display their patriotism therefore further stimulating the economy.

I know that sounds all conspiracy theorist but would anyone put it past our state and federal government?

[eaglejelly]

Ya know I don't want to sound all conspiracy theorist here but I think there may be a state, and federal movement purposely singling out those who display their patriotism.

Think about it for a second. We are STILL in an economic downturn and NOTHING motivates people to go out and buy sh!t that is patriotic in nature more then stories of patriotism being challenged. If enough patriotism is squelched it could cause an upraor and thus make people feel they need to go out and buy American sh!t in order to display their patriotism therefore further stimulating the economy.

I know that sounds all conspiracy theorist but would anyone put it past our state and federal government?

The flag mafia is behind this all, I knew it all the time

Edited May 12, 2010 by eaglejelly