Triumph Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 (edited) To be fair, this is a pretty terrible comment. Goalie performance is incredibly subjective and to put someone in a box like that doesn't fly. If you want to say that someone who doesn't think Lundqvist is one of the better goalies in the league is not worth listening to, that's a different story. i disagree. i don't think goalie performance is very subjective. i certainly think it's absurd to rank goalies 1-30 - statistics certainly don't tell enough for that - but it's not difficult to group goalies in terms of their class, and lundqvist is in the first group. if goalie performance is so subjective, and lundqvist has absolutely owned the devils, you'd think that more people around here would be thinking he's good. Edited November 30, 2009 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amberite Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 i disagree. i don't think goalie performance is very subjective. i certainly think it's absurd to rank goalies 1-30 - statistics certainly don't tell enough for that - but it's not difficult to group goalies in terms of their class, and lundqvist is in the first group. if goalie performance is so subjective, and lundqvist has absolutely owned the devils, you'd think that more people around here would be thinking he's good. It is subjective in terms of there being many factors which can make a goalie good, and some people may see these things differently. There are lots of people that can make pretty good arguments on why Brodeur is not the best in the league (strong team in front of him, defense-first mentality, etc etc). For these reasons, if someone lays out a good argument for you and says Brodeur is not top 5 in the league, can you really argue? If we put Brodeur in back of Carolina, would he still do as well? We'll never know, and that's why it's subjective. However, if someone said Brodeur is a terrible goalie and completely dismissed him (like that guy with the "Brodeur Sucks" blog), you have to start questioning things. I don't think there are many people here saying Lundqvist is bad, but to say people who think he's not top 5 in the league aren't worth listening to doesn't make sense. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devil Dan 56 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 when have the rangers had a good team? when have they had a defenseman significantly better than nhl average? they had decent teams in 07 and 08 and managed a series win in both years. last year the only reason why the rangers had a chance at a series win was henrik lundqvist, as the rest of the team played basically terrible. Lundqvist wasn't exactly amazing in that series. While he was great in games 2 and 4, he got pulled in 2 straight games and allowed a total of 9 goals in 4 periods in games 5 and 6. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njdevil26 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I don't want to go ahead and say Lundqvist is an elite goalie on his own. On a team like the Rangers, he's a "great" goalie that can steal some games. If Lundqvist was the goalie for the Sharks, Blackhawks, or Devils, we'd be calling him an absolute elite goalie and one of the best ever. It unfortunately has a lot to do with the people in front of you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sameblood Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 At the end of the day, I just think Lundqvist is ridiculously overrated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrydevil Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 At the end of the day, I just think Lundqvist is ridiculously overrated. How about at the beginning of the day? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
adavid Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 I suspect most teams would take him in a heartbeat. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 At the end of the day, I just think Lundqvist is ridiculously overrated. By who though? Yeah, a lot of Ranger fans act like he's already won multiple Cups, and Trautwig practically soiled himself when Lundqvist was winning a lot of shootouts early on last season, but other than that I don't hear that much gushing over him. He's clearly in the upper echelon (top 10) of NHL goaltenders...he puts up very good win totals and save%s every season, and the teams in front of him have been pretty good mish-moshes at best. Like I pointed out, he's had to come up big late to help his teams get into the playoffs. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jerrydevil Posted November 30, 2009 Share Posted November 30, 2009 By who though? Yeah, a lot of Ranger fans act like he's already won multiple Cups. He gets his share of criticism from Ranger fans, too, because he can be streaky, but this is a guy the Rangers did right by paying. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sickman Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) Lundqvist- Extremely weak glove hand and a rather one dimensional goalie. Not that this is a bad thing but he offers very little besides purely stopping the puck. He plays his angles really well and has very good reflexes but lacks puck handling skills and doesn't have a lot of variety in his game. Like many have already said though he is very inconsistent. He is either lights out or tends to struggle for extended periods of time. Personally I don't care for the way he plays but he can be extremely difficult to beat when he is on his game. The Rangers may have never had a great D since he has been here but there have been times when they played really well defensively and Lundqvist has shined as a result. But that goes for any goalie really. If you play behind a sh*t team you are going to have sh*t results no matter how good you are. If he were to play on a really good team he would win a ton of games. Is he top 5? I'm not sold on that but he wouldn't be far off and easily top 6 or 7. Whatever the case the Rangers have no shot at all without him but the King nonsense has to go though. Fwiw imo there are the top 3 and then there is everyone else. 4 - 8 could be arranged many different ways. 1. Brodeur - even at age 37 there is no one better when he is in top form. lots of weapons in his arsenal. 2. Luongo - like Brodeur he is a beast when in top form. He can dominate games. 3. Kiprusoff - always plays and WINS lots of games consistently. fun to watch too. Edited December 1, 2009 by SickMan Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sameblood Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 How about at the beginning of the day? I think he is a phenomenal dresser. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
robdeselich88 Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 over on HF boards.. whenever they list the top 10 goalies lundq makes it to the top 5. he is a top 10, but a gold medal is nice, but a gold medal with 3 cups is a lot better. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
justintime2989 Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 make that 18 goals against in 3 games Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SatansDevils Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Rangers now outscored 18-6 in the last 3-games. They have NO elite goaltender. Please...LOL! Lundqvist is a good goalie, but he is not an elite goaltender. No way. Sorry. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 3. Kiprusoff - always plays and WINS lots of games consistently. fun to watch too. kiprusoff was great, but he has been coasting on his reputation. last two years he's been first in the league in total goals against. that's partly because he plays a ton, but he's just not been very good. this year looks like a bounceback, and if kiprusoff can keep this up, he might edge his way back into the conversation involving top goaltenders. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) Rangers now outscored 18-6 in the last 3-games. They have NO elite goaltender. Please...LOL! Lundqvist is a good goalie, but he is not an elite goaltender. No way. Sorry. lundqvist vs NJ: 16-6-4, 1.85 GAA, .932 SV% nah he's not that good. it must be that ranger defense with sandis ozolinsh and wade redden and marek malik Edited December 1, 2009 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amberite Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) lundqvist vs NJ: 16-6-4, 1.85 GAA, .932 SV% nah he's not that good. it must be that ranger defense with sandis ozolinsh and wade redden and marek malik You're giving very skewed stats. It's pretty obvious that Lundqvist gets a hard on for playing the Devils, most likely because he gets to go head to head with Brodeur. Playing lights-out against one team on a consistent basis does not an overall consistent goalie make. Edited December 1, 2009 by Amberite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Pride 26 Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 lundqvist vs NJ: 16-6-4, 1.85 GAA, .932 SV% nah he's not that good. it must be that ranger defense with sandis ozolinsh and wade redden and marek malik I don't understand how any NJ fan say the queen isn't that good. Personally, I hate him, I wish we could slap him around a lot more and get that smug look off his face. But you can't say he doesn't have the ability to steal games which he has done plenty of times. For those of you that say he has done nothing in the playoffs, think about what marty has done since the lockout and without Stevens and Neids back there. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Poster Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 You're giving very skewed stats. It's pretty obvious that Lundqvist gets a hard on for playing the Devils, most likely because he gets to go head to head with Brodeur. Playing lights-out against one team on a consistent basis does not an overall consistent goalie make. More like a selective stat to continue an argument. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) You're giving very skewed stats. It's pretty obvious that Lundqvist gets a hard on for playing the Devils, most likely because he gets to go head to head with Brodeur. Playing lights-out against one team on a consistent basis does not an overall consistent goalie make. how is that 'obvious', other than you just said it with absolutely no evidence? lundqvist's numbers speak for themselves. 'consistent' is a meaningless word in a sports context besides very extreme examples. lundqvist is 3rd among active goalies in GAA and 2nd in SV%. putting him anywhere outside your top 6 is utter madness. edit: okay unknown poster you caught me, but satansdevils' post was just so bad that i couldn't help it. Edited December 1, 2009 by Triumph Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Amberite Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) lundqvist's numbers speak for themselves. 'consistent' is a meaningless word in a sports context besides very extreme examples. lundqvist is 3rd among active goalies in GAA and 2nd in SV%. Whoopdy-freakin-doo. This season, after 23 GP, he is 21st in SV% and 27th in GAA, sittin pretty at 11-10-1. You're right, he's definitely top 6 material. how is that 'obvious', other than you just said it with absolutely no evidence? [...]putting him anywhere outside your top 6 is utter madness. How is that 'madness', other than you just said it with absolutely no solid justification? Edited December 1, 2009 by Amberite Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Random Poster Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 edit: okay unknown poster you caught me, but satansdevils' post was just so bad that i couldn't help it. You've joined the club of those that fall into that trap lol Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 Whoopdy-freakin-doo. This season, after 23 GP, he is 21st in SV% and 27th in GAA, sittin pretty at 11-10-1. You're right, he's definitely top 6 material. and where do you think he will be at the end of the season? i wouldn't bet against him being top 10 in either category. the rangers are also currently playing some brutal defense. How is that 'madness', other than you just said it with absolutely no solid justification? uh, he's 3rd in GAA and 2nd in SV% among active goalies. this is even more ridiculous when you consider that older goalies have the benefit of the pre-lockout clutch and grab fests. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Neutral Zone Trap Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 (edited) and where do you think he will be at the end of the season? i wouldn't bet against him being top 10 in either category. the rangers are also currently playing some brutal defense. uh, he's 3rd in GAA and 2nd in SV% among active goalies. this is even more ridiculous when you consider that older goalies have the benefit of the pre-lockout clutch and grab fests. What ? not top 6 ??? Blasphemy 3rd in GAA and 2nd in SV % huh. Where is he in the stat that really matters.......wins ? Edited December 1, 2009 by Neutral Zone Trap Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yort44 Posted December 1, 2009 Share Posted December 1, 2009 lundqvist vs NJ: 16-6-4, 1.85 GAA, .932 SV% nah he's not that good. it must be that ranger defense with sandis ozolinsh and wade redden and marek malik Ya, but Clemmer OWNED him! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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