Horacio Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Question for you Devil fans...like me - and I hope I can get a number of opinions on this. Is Marty really the best goaltender in the NHL? Or has his success been the result of playing for a team that employs an extremely goaltender happy defensive system? As we watch Marty in the last twenty five or so games...it becomes somewhat clear to me, that his ability to "steal" games (what with a lack of regular defensemen playing right now) is not on a par with a goaltender for instance like Luongo. Is Marty really as good as his 398 wins attest to at this juncture of his career? Thoughts? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brodeurfanatic Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Good topic to talk about to start with your first post! I've been asking that question to myself too, but i think its both. Hard question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Derek21 Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I've always viewed Brodeur as an elite goalie (top five caliber guy). It's different now for him because he's no longer in the shadow behind Roy and Hasek. He's now the savvy vet as opposed to that young, free spirit you saw in '94. Positionally, he's as sound as any goalie out there. He's athletic and usually is in the right area for shots. And his puckhandling skills are a huge reason for his success and the Devils. His stickhandling has enabled the Devils to play the trap to perfection and not have their D-men killed playing pucks behind the net like other teams. It helps to have a warrior like Scott Stevens though because he is tough as they come and blocks a ton of shots. He also eliminates players and keeps them outside. These two factors are what make the Devils so tough to beat. Brodeur has won three Cups. You cannot argue with that. And you can't argue with his bounceback ability after tough losses. I can cite some examples. The knock on Marty is that he can't carry a team on his back. I am not sure if that's true or not. I thought he did a great job last year for the Devils because they had no offense to speak of. Elias had a bad year and they did it with D and goaltending. That's why Brodeur was up for the Hart. I still wouldn't bet against Brodeur in a big spot. He's won before. Who else can you say that about aside from Belfour? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
djstubbs Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I wonder who's been missing those past games... Brodeur has always had a great defense in front of him, which is what made him the goalie he is today... He can set up plays, and makes unbelieveable saves... The guy is definitely ELITE. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
GoJohnnyGo Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 No Marty ain't the best goalie in the NHL, he's just the best in the World. True our defensive style compliments him, but that's not why he's so great. You don't win as much as he does without being special. Some other goalie given the same run as he has "might" have been as successful, the key word being "might"? As all I know is that if I had to choose someone to play net for me, in a pressure situation, with it all on the line, Marty is the guy between the pipes for me. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LizDevil30 Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Marty beat Belfour. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I think where Marty wins in the greatness category is when it comes to consistency. He rarely has a "cold" streak. Even his recent "bad" streak isn't too bad for a lot of goalies. Look at how many 35 win seasons and 40 win seasons he has had and then look at his age, he is consistent, a workhorse, and puts up fantastic numbers. -Scott Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
deviledeggs Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Marty is a great goalie..... He makes some unbelievable saves, but lately hes had it rough... His defense is hurt and other teams are getting off a lot o shots... I remember the days when teams were only taking 15-20 shots on him and look at the Blackhawks game they took 35.... Hes gotta be tired of playing so much and facing more shots than ever... He is the best goalie in the NHL and in my opinion the best in the world.... Hes always had a great team in front of him but when they need a big stop hes usually there.... If he lets in 4 or 5 goals he usually bounces right back with a shutout or a huge game..... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lateralous Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Yes, I would say Marty is as great as we all think. Everyone wants to point to the recent Stevens injury as exposing Marty for being an average goalie. I think that the Stevens injury has force the Devils into a numbers game, playing 3-4 AHL caliber defensman a night. Obviously, all goalies are dependant on having a good defense in front of them. Right now, I don't think you can say the Devils defense is even good, especially the nights that Rafalski is out and Marty's is suffering because of it. Hale and Martin are both good young defenseman, but they are rookies who make mistakes, alot of them. I'm willing to live with the rookie mistakes, and it wasn't a big deal when you had the top 4 healthy, but when you add Brown, Albelin and to an extent, White's mistakes to the pile, it is hard to put up great numbers in net. Another thing that is working against Marty is that anything less than superhuman effort each night and people want to bring him down. Two recent examples are the game at Montreal where we lost 2-1 and the last Flyers game. Some people actually were on here calling that last goal at the Habs a soft goal. It was about the third rebound from in close with David Hale standing and admiring the play. In the Flyers game, I wouldn't call either of those goals weak. The first was a bang-bang play from in close. For some reason, alot of fans consider a 5 hole goal soft, no matter what the circumstances. The second one? Yes, there was a big rebound off of the LeClair shot, but what else is he going to do? Think about it, there is no way to stop a low hard shot to the far post without a rebound, so you kick it out of harms way as best you can. That play, it happened that a Flyer was coming in late and got the long rebound without being covered. I realize that this is a message board for this type of talk but questioning the only part of our team that I would consider to be top notch seems a little silly. This is in response to not only this thread, but numerous ones on here and HF questioning Broduer. The Devils have alot bigger issues that we should be focusing on like the previously stated defense and the fact that we play about 7 4th line forwards a night. Why aren't we praising Marty for keeping us in the division title hunt without Stevens & Langenbrunner for long periods of time, as well as numerous disappering acts by many of star players (Friesen and Madden), instead of questioning the guy? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SC Devs Fan Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Marty is certainly an elite tender, and he makes his team better, esp. the Dmen. Best in the NHL right now? From what I have seen, I think put smoe high quality dmen in front of Luongo and you'll see some stellar numbers; fortunately for us, I dopn't see that happening anytime soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpeakoftheDevil(s) Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I wouldnt trade Marty for another Goaltender in the league. Could the Devils have won 3 cups without him? Im not too sure. That being said, the fact he has played behind Scott Stevens, the NJ Defense and the NJ system for all these years....in addition,to his likable personality/demeanor, and his unprecedented stick handling skills have made the media "sell" Brodeur as the best in the business. The bottom line is minus Scott Stevens, and put Marty on a lesser team, with a less effective system, and Brodeur simply would not be considered among the best now let alone of all time. He needs NJ, as much as NJ needs him. I believe Marty knows that too. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
coldply123 Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Martin Brodeur will be known as one of the best goalies in the history of the sport of hockey....Im willing to argue by the time hes done he may have been the best... Im sick of everybody else including analysts pointing to the defense in front of him..... Has anyone thought that maybe our defense looks so good BECAUSE OF MARTY!!!!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elias Sports Bureau Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 He IS an elite goalie. He's also the right goalie for this team and what they do and try to do and a great part of that comes from what Marty's able to do. It may be tiring to hear that Marty has success because of the Devils system, but I think I get more tired of hearing them say the Devils win because of Marty. The Devils win when they play their system and EVERYONE plays their role. He just happens to be the most visible piece on the board. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cyrisjoe Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 id say he was an elite goalie, for a team that does not score many goals, mostly 2, but these dont come quickly, he has to sustain the pressure of the other team so he can give them a chance, he preserves the right to win by keeping it 0-0 until his team can score, THEN the defense picks up and tightens up and he has to make minimal saves.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lemieux22MVP Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 man you guys sound like wfan, espn radio, and all the uneducated callers who brag about their dismal teams (rangers, iles, devil haters). marty goes through his spells of soft goals but this guy is an elite goaltender and is responsible for our past 10 sucessful years. when all is said and done marty will be one of the top 3 goaltenders to ever play the game and people dont take advantage of that. mar--tin mar---tin, i can remember hearing those chants during the 95 playoff run when the heavily favored wings were swept by our beloved devils. not only is he one of the greatest goalies to ever be on the ice, he gave the confidence to his team, that even though they may be underdogs they knew they had the best goalie behind them who could win a game on any given night. goalies are a different breed, many of them very strange (belfour, vernon, hasek) they dont appreciate the fans or the game, marty is level headed and comes to the rink with a smile on his face everyday. we have a defensive minded system which does help but how many teams have modeled themselves after us since 95, we keep on winning because of him. if mike dunham was in net for us, our defensive minded system would not have allowed him to have 7? straight 30 win seasons. maty has a lot to do with it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Weekes Head Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Honestly, I could care less if Marty was the best in the world or not, and it never bothers me when people like to challenge him and say that so-and-so is better, because what it comes down to for me is that he gets the job done in true fashion. He's a-okay in my book Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
poohbear Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Haven't read the rest of the thread yet as I don't want to sway my opinion. Not that it could. Marty is as good as we think he is! AND he is as good as his defense. Just when I think it's because of the guys in front of him he comes up with an unbelievable save that leaves me shaking my head. God, I love to watch him in action! So, yes, he does owe alot of his success to his defense but then, they owe alot of their success to him. It's a beautiful thing! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJD Jester Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Not to send anyone away from here, but there is a sick debate on the HF Boards about this right now that both JasonMac and I are stuck in. The prevaling thought is that the Devils' defense was "already great" before Marty "emerged." I mean, it's gotten to the point where I'm starting to wonder if some of these posters have ever watched the guy play... <JESTER> Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RolandNJD Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 (edited) I think when he won the Gold Medal it proved to a lot of people it was not just because he was on the Devils. Since I don't have the right to watch a lot of regular season games in Canada... from what I see on the goals he's allowed in (on the NHL.com highlight section) it looks as though a lot of goals come from the D not being able to move bodies out of Marty's way... I saw this in a few of the Blackhawks goals. Doesn't matter who you are. If you can't see the puck how are you going to stop it? Anyway, Marty's as good as ever. Everyone is struggling a little without Stevens. Brodeur has still made some very good saves. In my opinion, he's having a bit of an off-year overall. Being in the playoffs for another 20+ games in 3 out of 4 years can do that to you. And from what the Devils have gone through this year... it's gonna take its toll on everybody. Cheers, - Roland Edited March 13, 2004 by RolandNJD Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StarDew Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Geez...this subject again?? Someone ressurect X-man or GR??????????? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jas0nMacIsaac Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Stats never tell the true story, the thing with Brodeur is that his mental game is ages ahead of any other goaltender. He may not allow allow a goal or two but when the game means something and it is late in the game, Brodeur has been known to make the big save to either give his team a chance to win or keep us ahead. This is Fuhr, Brodeur, Dryden, and Roy syndrome. If we lose this game I feel Clemmensen will get a couple of starts to finish the season, give brodeur a break. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevs4978 Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Actually the offense is currently ranked 18th out of 30 teams, which is below average. And that's with the recent goal surge from the EGG line. I do agree Marty's been letting in 'some' questionable ones lately but I submit it has more to do with him being overplayed and the DEFENSE getting worse without Stevens than it is Marty getting 'exposed'. You don't get exposed after winning three Cups. For instance the other night I'm not even sure any of the goals against the Blackhawks were Marty's fault and he gave up four. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Joe Mac Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 Brodeur is up there system or not. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
David Puddy Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 And today, you can't fault Marty for either of the goals. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pepperkorn Posted March 13, 2004 Share Posted March 13, 2004 I think he's great. and I think I'm right! He's been great with Stevens in front of him he's sucked wioth Stevens in front of him He won the gold medal without Stevens in the same State much less team. Come on With maximum spin and I can spin anything Stevens like no one EVER could -- is perhaps Stevens makes him a better everyday goalie but I really dont think so. No matter WHAT There is no doubt Marty is the best clutch goalie in the game. One of the best clutch goalies EVER. but... well... the defense and the "system" -- now THEY seem to be a little lost without Stevens. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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