BostonNala370 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 Can I ask an honest question, without getting my head bitten off? What, exactly, has Bryce Salvador done in his career to earn this undying loyalty and respect from the locker room, coaching staff, and, presumably, Lou? As far back as I can remember, he's been a middling top-4 to top-6 defenseman with zero offensive talent and (if I'm being generous) above-average shutdown ability. Not including this season, he has an astounding 45 points in 5-1/2 seasons with the Devils (324 games) - unfair to judge him on his point contribution alone, I'm aware. But he's never been this astounding shutdown defenseman at any point in his career either, nor has he ever won a Norris or even been in the discussion. He's really not done anything worth mentioning since being named captain - small sample size of two seasons, but his teams have managed to surrender a seemingly ridiculous number of leads, and miss the playoffs twice. What HAS he accomplished that's worth mentioning? The only thing I can imagine is that he's perhaps one of the hardest working guys off the ice or something along those lines. Which is great. But hard work can only get you so far in professional sports, unfortunately. I could work my ass off in the gym every day but I sure as hell wouldn't be worthy of a spot on an NHL roster. Someone please enlighten me. To me, he's another cookie-cutter defensive defenseman that today's game has left behind. Maybe playing a lot of NHL games is enough. /rant Be fair you must ask easier questions. There might not be an answer to this difficult question. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dmann422 Posted November 4, 2014 Share Posted November 4, 2014 (edited) Can I ask an honest question, without getting my head bitten off? What, exactly, has Bryce Salvador done in his career to earn this undying loyalty and respect from the locker room, coaching staff, and, presumably, Lou? ...Cut for brevity /rant I've defended Salvador on here before, even I admit it's hard to do so lately. I'll ignore the 'C' on his chest for this, because we all know that does play a part in this but it's not tangible enough to discuss.His biggest plus in recent years IMO has been the fact that he was a key piece in our top ranked PK. Now with the PK crapping the bed his biggest contribution to the team can't be used in his defense. Accordingly, as Tri said, his minutes have recent declined. Yes, he is probably the worst dman on the team right now not named gelinas. But early in the season deboer has done him no favors by constantly putting him up against top quality lines with a huge liability in zidlicky as his partner. If you like advanced stats, sal has the highest 5v5 Corsi rel QOC of the team's defensmen. There is of course also a huge factor of perceptive bias- anytime he makes a mistake it's piled on because people are waiting for it to happen. Every time he makes a solid play it's ignored because people are waiting for his next mistake. IMO it comes down to 2 things- 1. We are playing 3 young guys on defense. Zidlicky is not a great defensive mentor, so a vet defensive minded guy other than Greene could be helpful in the lockeroom. 2- what is the better alternative? Gelinas is a worse defensman than Salvador, and if you were to sit sal and play anyone else, who do you trust on the PK? Not zidlicky or gelinas... It's been pointed out that Sal's minutes have been diminished in recent games, he is starting to approach consistent 3rd pairing pairing territory. If that is the case for here on out, IMO that is more than acceptable as long as the PK picks it up a bit. Edited November 4, 2014 by dmann422 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Salvador had a great playoff run the year the Devils lost to the Kings in the finals. He stood out both defensively and offensively with some unexpected timely goals and assists. This is worth mentioning. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ELIAS6 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Salvador had a great playoff run the year the Devils lost to the Kings in the finals. He stood out both defensively and offensively with some unexpected timely goals and assists. This is worth mentioning. and that was great 3 years ago but he hasnt been any good since Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ATLL765 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) and that was great 3 years ago but he hasnt been any good since That stretch of solid play from him, especially the unexpected offense, is the reason why he got a new contract for $9.5M over 3 years instead of something more like $5-6M over 2 years. I still think that if in 2013 San Jose could flip Douglas Murray to Pittsburgh for their 2013 2nd round pick and a conditional 2014 2/3 rd pick(the conditions were met, so the pick was Pittsburgh's 2014 2nd rd pick) at the deadline, that we can get a 2nd or 3rd round pick for Salvador from a team looking for that stereotypical tough, good at clearing the front of the net, veteran, defense-first defenseman. They're comparable defenseman with similar Fenwick% & Corsi% numbers over the last few years. Bryce's stats are actually a bit better, probably because even he is quicker than Douglas Murray, lol. Edited November 5, 2014 by ATLL765 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Can I ask an honest question, without getting my head bitten off? What, exactly, has Bryce Salvador done in his career to earn this undying loyalty and respect from the locker room, coaching staff, and, presumably, Lou? I think, at least to other players, being a great guy and a good role model in terms of professionalism etc is valued. Not saying it should be or shouldn't, I just think that's the case with Sal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) Gotta be happy for schneider who's FINALLY the man on a team. Good for him Sure, think most of us are very happy for him (hopefully the geniuses who proclaimed him "overrated" about nine games into the season are starting to see that he's a fine puck-stopper, and since the start of the 2010-11 season, the Devils have only had that in the second halves of 2011 and 2012, and roughly about 55-60% of the year last season, mostly when Cory was starting). But Cory was pretty much the man the day he signed his contract, and when Lou didn't bring anyone who was even a slight threat to Cory (Clemmensen might be the worst goalie in the NHL right now), his status as the man was cemented that much more. But I AM glad that Cory got both games of the earlier back-to-back, and has started every game so far this season. I'm not going to kill PDB for anything that went on last season, re: the goalie situation...it was a crappy situation for everyone, and basically a no-win...but the (undeserved) white-knight treatment Marty received last season was really hard to take, as were the quotes from Marty, PDB, his teammates...just about everyone involved. Obviously Cory can't start all 82 games, and I'm guessing his backup(s) will get 10-15 starts, but at least now one bad start doesn't mean he may not play for 3-4 games. Edited November 5, 2014 by Colorado Rockies 1976 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BostonNala370 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) Cammy, Merrill and Havlet won't make trip to St Louis and Detroit per Lou. Edited November 5, 2014 by BostonNala370 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) Cammy, Merritt and Havlet won't make trip to St Louis and Detroit per Lou.Great. Oh but Cammo is 'close'. My ass. And Havlat- just forget it at this point. Dude is made of cray paper. Congrats to him for making it through a whole 4 games though. Edited November 5, 2014 by MadDog2020 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William D'Aquila Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Why are we attacking Salvador again? You guys don't get it, the Devils do not have a defenseman with his skill set to eat up PK time. Until one arrives either from within the system or from outside, Salvador will continue to get minutes. PPG from last night was on Cory not him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jtx00 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 (edited) I think at least 1, and most likely 2 of Larsson/Severson/Merrill/Gelinas need to show that they're ready to be cemented into a top 4 role before it would even be considered to take Salvador out of the lineup. And that's almost impossible at their young ages. I can't think of many (if any) coaches in this league who would be comfortable with 4 kids holding the blueline. Until then, the best we can hope for is a steady reduction in TOI (which seems to be the case). Edited November 5, 2014 by jtx00 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BostonNala370 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Why are we attacking Salvador again? You guys don't get it, the Devils do not have a defenseman with his skill set to eat up PK time. Until one arrives either from within the system or from outside, Salvador will continue to get minutes. PPG from last night was on Cory not him. Are you blaming last night's loss on Cory? Good luck with that! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck the Duck Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Cory was great last night...especially in the first period when it seemed like the Blues were getting odd man rushes every time they broke out of their zone. When you only give up 1 goal in a game, you should win that game. Can't blame the goalie or defense for that one. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Cory's allowed 13 goals in his last 6 GP (5 of which came in Pittsburgh debacle, maybe two of which were his fault, if that many). He has a .927 save% in those 6. Devils have scored 12 for him in that time (not including the shootout). They've scored 21 in their last 10 GP, so it's not like Cory's getting vast amounts of goal support either (or defensive support...he's averaging almost 30 Shots-Against per game). Guy really has been pretty solid overall...maybe not entirely consistent in this small sample, but he's not far from what we were hoping for overall. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Cory was great last night...especially in the first period when it seemed like the Blues were getting odd man rushes every time they broke out of their zone. When you only give up 1 goal in a game, you should win that game. Can't blame the goalie or defense for that one.Annnnd BINGO was his name-o. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
William D'Aquila Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Are you blaming last night's loss on Cory? Good luck with that! Not at all, but it was a stoppable shot. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BostonNala370 Posted November 5, 2014 Share Posted November 5, 2014 Not at all, but it was a stoppable shot. Every shot is a stoppage shot but you should reread your post. Your should be pleased that Cory is in net he maybe the only thing positive about this team this season that Lou has put together. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BostonNala370 Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Henrique out day to day according to Lou, you know what that means 2 weeks, Lou lies! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Henrique out day to day according to Lou, you know what that means 2 weeks, Lou lies! Wow, spot on observation. The Devils have never had a day to day injury in their history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DevsMan84 Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Wow, spot on observation. The Devils have never had a day to day injury in their history. Cammy has been day-to-day for almost 2 weeks now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Cammy has been day-to-day for almost 2 weeks now. Another point in favor of the Devils never having day to day injuries in their entire history. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck the Duck Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 3 of the top 6 out with injuries at the same time...recipe for disaster for almost any team, especially when you factor in the teams we are playing over the next week or so. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devilsfan118 Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 (edited) Holy crap.. it's obvious to us who watch the games, but the stats are really telling as well - this team is atrocious offensively as far as forward talent is concerned. Zubrus with 2 points in 12 games, Brunner with 3 in 8, Zajac and Clowe with 4 in 12, even Elias with 6 in 12.. these are highly paid players that just aren't getting it done for one reason or another. I'm especially disappointed with Zajac. I always hoped he'd be a 60-point, responsible forward that could be called upon to chip in when needed..looking like those years with Parise and Kovalchuk really inflated any sort of value he had. Hope he's thanked them both tremendously for the contract he signed last year. He's 30 next year so he probably only has like 4-5 more 'prime' years left. Christ what a disappointment. The forwards on this team have scored 23 goals in 12 games so far this season, according to NHL.com. On the other end of the spectrum you have the Penguins - who've gotten 42 goals from their forwards thus far. It's really bleak right now. Again - nothing we didn't already know. I'm sure the stats guys can throw out even more compelling stuff...but I wonder if this is one of the least talented forward groups the Devils have iced in recent memory. Edited November 6, 2014 by Devilsfan118 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SterioDesign Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 At some point looking at our team... Slow. Old. Thin offensive talent. Terribly managed. Frustrated players. Bad contracts. Missed the playoffs 3 times in 4 years. Losing 3 players with decent from big value walk for nothing. Drafting badly. Aging core with no imminent replacement. No depth outside of NHL. Not developing players as good as they did in the past. Bad decisions. Keep signing risky players. We all know who's fault this is. Well some may still be in denial but it's pretty obvious. He's been doing patching work for too long and losing too many assets. You can't build a strong team that way. There's "some bright side" to our team... Merril and Severson are really the only 2 things im excited about this team's future and it really won't be enough. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chuck the Duck Posted November 6, 2014 Share Posted November 6, 2014 Rebuilding takes time and often looks much worse than what we are currently going through (I include the last 2 seasons as part of the re-build process this team is undertaking). They have done a very good job drafting talented Dmen that are starting to pay dividends now. Hopefully they can do the same for the forward core in the next few years as there is no organizational depth there. Does Lou deserve some blame for the years of wasted draft picks, absolutely. But just about every organizations outside of Detroit goes through down periods like this. And who they sign in FA is as much about playing in NJ rather than some other markets as it is anything else. We aren't an attractive destination for most top FA's unless we overpay in $$ and/or years and, honestly, can you really blame some of these players. While we know what NJ has to offer, all anyone outside this area knows about the state are factories, Snooki, and the Sopranos. Plus, they come into our half empty, lifeless building 1 or 2 times per year and can't be overly impressed by the experience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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