TheMazz Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 How many old mentors do we need with Elias, Zubrus and perhaps Gomez back? More old mentors and other over 30 older guys (Camm, Tootoo, Bernier?, Zajac, Gionta) upfront means less opportunities for younger guys. Not all of them will be back - maybe. I would rather take a shot elsewhere with a couple of those slots. We were older than dirt overall last year avg age wise, even after shedding some Jagr, Sal, Clowe, Ryder, Zidlicky there still going to be old up front. Sure, we could go younger on RW, but that would most likely involve a significant trade and trading assets that would be way to rich for our blood. Zubrus could and should be bought out, Ryder and Havlat won't return, Gomez, meh but even if all of this fodder we are shedding, its not like there is anything significant to replace them with. I am not getting why people are so up in arms over this potentially happening. Worst case senario, MSL bombs and we ship him off at the deadline or just not resign him. Best case? He has another 40-50 point season and everyone is happy. Look, I rather take a zero risk contract like MSL then trade significant assets for a overrated "younger" winger in Kessel or overpay for another overrated RWer in Beleskey. What exactly do we have in the RW department to be proud of? Bernier? Ruutu? Tootoo? Would MSL really be THAT bad compared to what we have now? For one year? I'm just not seeing the disadvantage in all of this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) How many old mentors do we need with Elias, Zubrus and perhaps Gomez back? More old mentors and other over 30 older guys (Camm, Tootoo, Bernier?, Zajac, Gionta) upfront means less opportunities for younger guys. Not all of them will be back - maybe. I would rather take a shot elsewhere with a couple of those slots. We were older than dirt overall last year avg age wise, even after shedding some Jagr, Sal, Clowe, Ryder, Zidlicky there still going to be old up front. What younger guys besides Boucher, Kalinin and Matteau? These are literally the only younger guys that are likely to be on the team. Boucher and Kalinin are not locks. None of the draft picks this year are likely to be on there, but that remains to be seen. That's part of the point people are making. Let's assume that no UFAs (forwards) are brought back, which is not a stretch. Gomez and Bernier could easily walk and I dont think anyone would give a crap. Havlat and Ryder are goners. Clowe is going to be LTIR and not even playing. That's 5 forward spots we potentially have to fill. It could even be as high as 6 if we go with 7 D-Men instead of 8. I'm reading people suggesting we sign Justin Williams and other of the bigger named UFAs who make absolutely no sense for this club at this point in time, besides the fact that we would have to overpay in every respect (years + money) to get them here. I cannot for the life of me see the argument some are making against the idea of MSL for 1-2 years tops. Cap space won't be an issue. Taking a spot from a "younger guy" is a weak argument. We don't have enough younger guys that even deserve a crack at the big club yet besides the two already mentioned and potentially one draft pick from this year's draft at most. Obviously, any trade before the season begins could change everything. Next offseason we have even more gone. Patty, Ruutu, Gionta, and Tootoo are all gone. MSL coming onboard for an insignificant amount of time is a much safer move than signing a Justin Williams or Matt fvcking Beleskey. Edited June 5, 2015 by ghdi Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMazz Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 What younger guys besides Boucher, Kalinin and Matteau? These are literally the only younger guys that are likely to be on the team. Boucher and Kalinin are not locks. None of the draft picks this year are likely to be on there, but that remains to be seen. That's part of the point people are making. Let's assume that no UFAs (forwards) are brought back, which is not a stretch. Gomez and Bernier could easily walk and I dont think anyone would give a crap. Havlat and Ryder are goners. Clowe is going to be LTIR and not even playing. That's 5 forward spots we potentially have to fill. It could even be as high as 6 if we go with 7 D-Men instead of 8. I'm reading people suggesting we sign Justin Williams and other of the bigger named UFAs who make absolutely no sense for this club at this point in time, besides the fact that we would have to overpay in every respect (years + money) to get them here. I cannot for the life of me see the argument some are making against the idea of MSL for 1-2 years tops. Cap space won't be an issue. Taking a spot from a "younger guy" is a weak argument. We don't have enough younger guys that even deserve a crack at the big club yet besides the two already mentioned and potentially one draft pick from this year's draft at most. Obviously, any trade before the season begins could change everything. Next offseason we have even more gone. Patty, Ruutu, Gionta, and Tootoo are all gone. MSL coming onboard for an insignificant amount of time is a much safer move than signing a Justin Williams or Matt fvcking Beleskey. THIS. This guy gets it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils Pride 26 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 What younger guys besides Boucher, Kalinin and Matteau? These are literally the only younger guys that are likely to be on the team. Boucher and Kalinin are not locks. None of the draft picks this year are likely to be on there, but that remains to be seen. That's part of the point people are making. Let's assume that no UFAs (forwards) are brought back, which is not a stretch. Gomez and Bernier could easily walk and I dont think anyone would give a crap. Havlat and Ryder are goners. Clowe is going to be LTIR and not even playing. That's 5 forward spots we potentially have to fill. It could even be as high as 6 if we go with 7 D-Men instead of 8. I'm reading people suggesting we sign Justin Williams and other of the bigger named UFAs who make absolutely no sense for this club at this point in time, besides the fact that we would have to overpay in every respect (years + money) to get them here. I cannot for the life of me see the argument some are making against the idea of MSL for 1-2 years tops. Cap space won't be an issue. Taking a spot from a "younger guy" is a weak argument. We don't have enough younger guys that even deserve a crack at the big club yet besides the two already mentioned and potentially one draft pick from this year's draft at most. Obviously, any trade before the season begins could change everything. Next offseason we have even more gone. Patty, Ruutu, Gionta, and Tootoo are all gone. MSL coming onboard for an insignificant amount of time is a much safer move than signing a Justin Williams or Matt fvcking Beleskey. Looks like it only took 35 minutes to get the POD. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ELIAS6 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 so much speculation on a guy that is not going to come here..hes at the end of his career hes going to want to go to some type of a contender its well known that this team most likely wont even break into the playoffs next season why would he want to come waste his time here... same situation as to why jagr wanted out of here Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Devils731 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 so much speculation on a guy that is not going to come here..hes at the end of his career hes going to want to go to some type of a contender its well known that this team most likely wont even break into the playoffs next season why would he want to come waste his time here... same situation as to why jagr wanted out of here Or he wants a bigger paycheck for the year knowing he can transfer to a contender(and more easily fit under their cap) near the deadline Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 so much speculation on a guy that is not going to come here..hes at the end of his career hes going to want to go to some type of a contender its well known that this team most likely wont even break into the playoffs next season why would he want to come waste his time here... same situation as to why jagr wanted out of here I don't disagree with you in some respects. But there is a real possibility that since St. Louis is at the end of his career he may just want to play another year or two close to his current home which is in Connecticut. He could also look at it from the perspective of having a good first half and then gets traded at the deadline. He may not have any other choice. Playing for us could basically be an "audition" for a contender. Don't compare anyone to Jagr though. Jagr is his own beast and he does things Jagr's way. I don't think MSL comes to the Devils frankly. But he exists as an option for us and should be considered in our current state. We will not get younger overnight. Its a process thats going to take a few seasons unless they decide to blow it up completely. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titans04 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The St. Louis that played in the playoffs and for most of the second half brings what value when he's even a year older at next years trade deadline? Then factor is he potentially will be playing on a team with significantly less talent than what he had around him this year. He's got to be carried at this point in his career, that's not going to happen here. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
peteyvegas51 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Of course. We dont have any scorers. At this point, I'd take Jagr back. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The St. Louis that played in the playoffs and for most of the second half brings what value when he's even a year older at next years trade deadline? Then factor is he potentially will be playing on a team with significantly less talent than what he had around him this year. He's got to be carried at this point in his career, that's not going to happen here. If he carries the value of a 7th round pick he's still worth signing. The Devils have nothing to lose but money. If he's terrible, great, the whole team is going to be terrible, what's lost here? 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ELIAS6 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 The St. Louis that played in the playoffs and for most of the second half brings what value when he's even a year older at next years trade deadline? Then factor is he potentially will be playing on a team with significantly less talent than what he had around him this year. He's got to be carried at this point in his career, that's not going to happen here. agreed he's not going to be the same player on this team that he is on the Rangers there is a significant lack of talent here .. imo this is not a great option enless it comes down to it and there is really no better way to go about filling the spot on the roster Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaira_Devil_#9 Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Let's face it this team can't really get any worse through short term free agent signings. The only way it gets worse is trading future assets for players like Kessel. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Marshall Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 Let's face it this team can't really get any worse through short term free agent signings. The only way it gets worse is trading future assets for players like Kessel. Technically doesn't get worse but stays bad/mediocre for longer. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMazz Posted June 5, 2015 Author Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) The St. Louis that played in the playoffs and for most of the second half brings what value when he's even a year older at next years trade deadline? Then factor is he potentially will be playing on a team with significantly less talent than what he had around him this year. He's got to be carried at this point in his career, that's not going to happen here. Even if he doesn't get flipped for a pick, we have him on the books for a year. As mentioned, nothing gets lost but money. I rather see MSL, even in this stage of his career for one year in our top six then someone like Bernier or Ryder, or Havlat (all three who are potential goners) We have the spot for him, who would he be taking a roster spot from? MSL, Boucher, Matteau, Ruutu. There are your RWs for next year. And actually, I wouldn't even say Boucher deserves a full time spot as of yet. So, who would he be taking a roster spot from? Zubrus? Whoopie. Edited June 5, 2015 by TheMazz Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
devlman Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 1 year deal would be great Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AEWHistory Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 (edited) agreed, lets bring him herte to trade him at the deadline?? moronic!!While I get the gist of your argument, I would have to counter by saying that I would sign tradeable assets every year if I thought I could reasonably expect a return of a 2nd or 3rd should we not need them come the deadline. It is a win-win. Either you have a vet come playoff time or you add another draft pick, and I, for one, believe the Devils can use all the picks they can get. However, this isn't a strategy you can pull off every year. I just wouldn't reject it out of hand.The only downsides are if he is taking playing time from younger or better players. In the Devils case I am not sure he would be, but I haven't followed closely enough to be sure. But even if he has slipped, the key metric is really relative, not absolute. If he is still better than what we have and could still garner interest at the trade deadline, then signing him is a viable strategy. Edited June 5, 2015 by AEWHistory Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AEWHistory Posted June 5, 2015 Share Posted June 5, 2015 If he carries the value of a 7th round pick he's still worth signing. The Devils have nothing to lose but money. If he's terrible, great, the whole team is going to be terrible, what's lost here? I agree, although I would hope that if we were going to have him taking space on the roster we'd be able to flip him for more than a 7th should the need arise. However, I have no idea if that expectation is out of line--I simply haven't followed MSL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ghdi Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 The St. Louis that played in the playoffs and for most of the second half brings what value when he's even a year older at next years trade deadline? Then factor is he potentially will be playing on a team with significantly less talent than what he had around him this year. He's got to be carried at this point in his career, that's not going to happen here. Its not a stretch to think he has a strong first half (relatively speaking) in a new situation as motivation simply to get contenders interested in him for the deadline. If he succeeds, great, we get an asset for cap space we weren't going to be using anyway. He could lead this team in scoring depending on who he was paired with. His hands are still there. Yes, he was playing with better forwards this past season, but he still outscored anyone on this team by 9 points. If this scenario was to pan out (MSL coming here), it's literally no risk. Even if he was garbage he'd be gone in a year or in the worst case scenario, waived or he retires. The arguments against are literally empty. We're in the position to take these chances as it stands today. There's enough room to play our prospects that will need to play and take a flier on MSL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chimaira_Devil_#9 Posted June 6, 2015 Share Posted June 6, 2015 Technically doesn't get worse but stays bad/mediocre for longer. I don't think so. If you sign anyone to a short deal, even two years they won't be holding this current team back. They aren't holding any players back from developing currently or for the next two years. In two seasons times maybe, but there is so little coming through and so many players next year due to go that there are always going to be opportunities. In terms of the level of play, where is the quality to improve going to come from? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMazz Posted June 26, 2015 Author Share Posted June 26, 2015 On other news, told that Marty St. Louis not ready to retire. May be some mutual interest in/from Devils, Penguins. Not coming back to NYR. Per writer Larry Brooks Time to get this reved up again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
RizzMB30 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 If we can't grab a Vermette or Stafford, or Frolik. Yeah, screw it. Worst case scenario he plays with Zajac and Boucher for a while. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 I see us getting Frolik and also getting St Louis, unfortunately. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Triumph Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Frolik would be a horrible signing, I sure hope not. Luckily Lavoie said there were 12 teams interested in Frolik, so that makes it very unlikely. St. Louis, OTOH, would be great though the Penguins being interested probably kills NJ's chances (although the Penguins are quite cap-strapped) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheMazz Posted June 26, 2015 Author Share Posted June 26, 2015 Frolik would be a horrible signing, I sure hope not. Luckily Lavoie said there were 12 teams interested in Frolik, so that makes it very unlikely. St. Louis, OTOH, would be great though the Penguins being interested probably kills NJ's chances (although the Penguins are quite cap-strapped) If MSL thinks he is gonna win a cup with the Penguins then he'll prob go there. If he wants the ice time, he'll come to a team like us. That's how I see it anyway. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
titans04 Posted June 26, 2015 Share Posted June 26, 2015 Hopefully TG is right and the Devils don't seem to be interested in MSL. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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