GDT: Game 2 - Rangers @ Devils - 20 Apr - 730p - TBS/MSG

[RizzMB30]

1 hour ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

And here’s why I have less than zero respect for Ranger fans:

After the fourth Ranger goal, a Devils fan who did NOTHING AT ALL as he was walking down the stairs to leave gets a drink thrown at him by a fvcking Rangers fan WITH HIS BACK TURNED…naturally he turns around and started jawing at the d!ckc*nt Rags fan, who tried to play it off as “Who me?”…quite a few of us called him out on it, and naturally the Ranger fans near him took HIS side.  HOW DO YOU fvckING DEFEND THAT SH!T?!

God I can’t possibly hate a fanbase worse than that one.  fvck you.  ALL OF YOU.

Not to be whiny, but that literally is assault. You have not idea what is in that cup before it was thrown. Doesn't the Rock have ushers??

In Pittsburgh, an usher will see you and have the person thrown out for that sh!t. 

[RizzMB30]

Just now, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

Even if Ruff made sense there, I don’t see him even being able to make the on-the-fly adjustments the Devils sorely need their head coach to make.  It’s not that they’re losing, it’s how it’s happening…starting with Kreider being left open over and over again.  And Lindy insisting on playing penalty-prone boneheads who are doing exactly what we knew that they would.

I'm not sure what Siegs did to warrant sitting compared to Wood, but be specific, what adjustment on-the-fly would you have liked to have seen?

 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Just now, RizzMB30 said:

Not to be whiny, but that literally is assault. You have not idea what is in that cup before it was thrown. Doesn't the Rock have ushers??

In Pittsburgh, an usher will see you and have the person thrown out for that sh!t. 

Oh I’m with ya.  And no ushers in sight.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

Just now, RizzMB30 said:

I'm not sure what Siegs did to warrant sitting compared to Wood, but be specific, what adjustment on-the-fly would you have liked to have seen?

 

Something resembling PK coverage on Kreider would’ve been a start.  

[Nicomo]

Btw I’m sorry to anyone I gave sh!t to for criticizing Palat down the stretch. It’s obviously only the first season of a 5 year deal, and maybe he’ll bounce back, but it sure looks pretty disastrous right about now. 

0 goals in his last 20 GP. 

[NJDevils1214]

Lindy shuffling the lines every game is like the hockey equivalent of George Costanza looking angry at work so people think he's busy. He's out of ideas!

[Devs64]

5 minutes ago, RizzMB30 said:

Cry more about it. You don't speak for me nor do I speak for you. I wouldn't even want to speak for you. Let us go our separate ways now. 

If the Devils turn this around, I'm sure you'll be here telling me I was right or saying you were wrong. 

 

5 minutes ago, RizzMB30 said:

Cry more about it. You don't speak for me nor do I speak for you. I wouldn't even want to speak for you. Let us go our separate ways now. 

If the Devils turn this around, I'm sure you'll be here telling me I was right or saying you were wrong. 

Right or wrong about what? All I meant in that post is that despite winning more than losing, the team limped into the playoffs and the lack of playoff readiness became evident. I'm not a bandwagon fan, and I look forward to winning at MSG and possibly the series as much as everyone else. No need to be disrespectful because you didn't like the post.

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

5 minutes ago, Devs64 said:

 

Right or wrong about what? All I meant in that post is that despite winning more than losing, the team limped into the playoffs and the lack of playoff readiness became evident. I'm not a bandwagon fan, and I look forward to winning at MSG and possibly the series as much as everyone else. No need to be disrespectful because you didn't like the post.

They won four of their final five games and outscored their opposition 25-10.  That is not really limping into the playoffs.  

[Devs64]

24 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

They won four of their final five games and outscored their opposition 25-10.  That is not really limping into the playoffs.  

OK, out of the last 20 games, 12 were against the teams in the playoff mix. Devils lost 8 of them. These stats don't mean anything now anyway. We had the Rags number and now they are kicking the living sh!t out of us. Game 3 is all that matters at this point.

[RizzMB30]

Just now, Devs64 said:

OK, out of the last 20 games, 12 were against the teams in the playoff mix. Devils lost 8 of them. These stats don't mean anything now anyway. We had the Rags number and now they are kicking the living sh!t out of us. Game 3 is all that matters at this point.

You're the one who brought it up.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yes game three is all that matters. I was only pointing out that if you're already selling on the Devils that it didn't take much. 

[Nicomo]

5 minutes ago, RizzMB30 said:

You're the one who brought it up.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yes game three is all that matters. I was only pointing out that if you're already selling on the Devils that it didn't take much. 

Didn’t take much? They’ve been out scored 10-2, and have exactly ZERO 5v5 goals through 2 games.

Pretty understandable if people feel like this one is already over. 

[Devs64]

3 minutes ago, RizzMB30 said:

You're the one who brought it up.  ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

Yes game three is all that matters. I was only pointing out that if you're already selling on the Devils that it didn't take much. 

I didn't bring up the stats, rather their game against the contenders which was quite concerning at times. BTW that was in one of my posts back then. I'm not selling on my team, just criticizing sometimes which is absolutely normal. You just jumped to a conclusion too fast...

[Devs64]

2 minutes ago, Nicomo said:

Didn’t take much? They’ve been out scored 10-2, and have exactly ZERO 5v5 goals through 2 games.

Pretty understandable if people feel like this one is already over. 

 Definitely not over, but these two games were a total disaster. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

4 hours ago, Devs64 said:

OK, out of the last 20 games, 12 were against the teams in the playoff mix. Devils lost 8 of them. These stats don't mean anything now anyway. We had the Rags number and now they are kicking the living sh!t out of us. Game 3 is all that matters at this point.

There still wasn’t a whole hell of a lot that pointed to the Devils getting curbstomped to this extent.  They won plenty of games during the season against tough competition.

But yeah, it’s all about Game 3 and beyond now.  And not getting killed yet AGAIN.  

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

I am going to caveat the rest of this post by first saying , this fvcking sucks and I hate it. Why the fvcking Rangers, of all teams, to come along and crush this group of guys. 

 

With that out the way, I have to say I am not totally surprised this is happening. I didn't expect us to look so completely lost, but I was expecting this to be rough. 

The coaches we have are not skilled tacticians, they are not great at reading the game. They miss so much obvious sh!t it's infuriating, BUT I do have faith that they will at least make sure the young guys take lessons  from this nightmare and develop. And that's what they are here to do, and that's what I am bearing in mind, and that's why I am not going totally insane. 

To me it feels like we are the 2017-18 Colorado Avalanche, we have turned the team around we have a lot of our core peices in place, they are developing in the right direction, things are looking good and we have just run into a team in win now mode who have been there before. 

This is going to be a massive eye opener for the young guys, as it should be. I know it's a tired cliche but its been boys against men. 

I think Lindy needs to be brave now and get Luke and Schimd on the ice and get them some playoff experience. If we are going to go out, at least make the most of the opportunity to get something out of it so the next time it comes round everyone can say "this isn't new, I have done this before, I know what it takes". 

I haven't given up hope, but we need to be practical about what we can take from this to make sure it doesn't happen again on a year's time. 

It should also be very clear to Fitz now about who has run their race in this team and what sort of players we should be looking at in the off-season and at the deadline next year. 

[jagknife]

6 hours ago, RizzMB30 said:

Idk...I kinda like what he said about it not being about one individual when the reporter asked if Miles Wood should be in the lineup with the penalties that he takes and suggested that Boquist come back in for him. 

While I agree that Wood should be yanked out until he can cut the 4 penalties a game sh!t, Ruff isn't wrong there. 

Wood’s penalties have been absolute back breakers. Both of them gave momentum right back to the Rangers and because the PK refuses to mark Kreider eventually gave them the lead.

He’s an undisciplined clown who brings nothing. But he’ll stay in the lineup for… reasons.

If you wanted to write off a badly timed, offensive zone penalty that cost us momentum and game 1, fine, but there is ZERO denying wood’s selfish decision last night cost them the game.

Even with the Taresenko equalizer goal, they were battling. They were nervous but they were battling and things were even. Then Wood decided to push whoever’s skates from under him (it was called a slash but certainly looked like a trip instead) and boom, 2-1 Rangers lead, Devils cannot answer.

Yes the team folded once they fell behind, but they fell behind cause of a selfish player taking stupid penalties AND coaches not stepping in and helping calm a young, inexperienced team to recognize their massive faults on the PK.

Every PK has been the same passive Diamond with barely pressure attempted on the puck carrier, and only one person in front of VV while two protect against circle one-timers, which the rangers absolutely don’t try to set up. But hey, I’m just a guy sitting on a couch that sees both teams strategies clear as day.

Edited April 21, 2023 by jagknife
Minor grammar or typo’s

[jagknife]

54 minutes ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

With that out the way, I have to say I am not totally surprised this is happening. I didn't expect us to look so completely lost, but I was expecting this to be rough. 

The coaches we have are not skilled tacticians, they are not great at reading the game. They miss so much obvious sh!t it's infuriating, BUT I do have faith that they will at least make sure the young guys take lessons  from this nightmare and develop. And that's what they are here to do, and that's what I am bearing in mind, and that's why I am not going totally insane. 

To me it feels like we are the 2017-18 Colorado Avalanche, we have turned the team around we have a lot of our core peices in place, they are developing in the right direction, things are looking good and we have just run into a team in win now mode who have been there before. 

This is going to be a massive eye opener for the young guys, as it should be. I know it's a tired cliche but its been boys against men. 

I think Lindy needs to be brave now and get Luke and Schimd on the ice and get them some playoff experience. If we are going to go out, at least make the most of the opportunity to get something out of it so the next time it comes round everyone can say "this isn't new, I have done this before, I know what it takes". 

I haven't given up hope, but we need to be practical about what we can take from this to make sure it doesn't happen again on a year's time. 

It should also be very clear to Fitz now about who has run their race in this team and what sort of players we should be looking at in the off-season and at the deadline next year. 

First two bolds: yup. 100%

Bold & Underlined: I was only half kidding last night when I insinuated Ole Yeller and Gersteen being brought in for Saturday… I’m legitimately concerned Schmid is going to be bypassed and Yeller will start at the Garden. I do not actually believe we will call up Kid Ray, however.

lastly, you are absolutely right about this being a learning experience. No one expects young teams to win it all year one. I woulda been happy with just making the playoffs when the season started. But I don’t want to get embarrassed the entire series, and right now they are.

Blame coaching, blame effort, choose your own adventure I do not care but the performance across the board right now is unacceptable. We have passengers on this team. We have liabilities. But we also have guys trying to do it all to overcome the liabilities. I’m sick of Jack playing into double and triple coverage to try and force a play. If I see one more cross-ice pass from ANYONE that tries to go through 2-3 back checkers to set up a 1 timer I’m going to turn off my TV (I won’t be facetious and say break something, but I already am yelling at my TV.)

the boys will learn the difference between regular and post season, but I beg them, please stop getting embarrassed doing it 

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

9 minutes ago, jagknife said:

First two bolds: yup. 100%

Bold & Underlined: I was only half kidding last night when I insinuated Ole Yeller and Gersteen being brought in for Saturday… I’m legitimately concerned Schmid is going to be bypassed and Yeller will start at the Garden. I do not actually believe we will call up Kid Ray, however.

lastly, you are absolutely right about this being a learning experience. No one expects young teams to win it all year one. I woulda been happy with just making the playoffs when the season started. But I don’t want to get embarrassed the entire series, and right now they are.

Blame coaching, blame effort, choose your own adventure I do not care but the performance across the board right now is unacceptable. We have passengers on this team. We have liabilities. But we also have guys trying to do it all to overcome the liabilities. I’m sick of Jack playing into double and triple coverage to try and force a play. If I see one more cross-ice pass from ANYONE that tries to go through 2-3 back checkers to set up a 1 timer I’m going to turn off my TV (I won’t be facetious and say break something, but I already am yelling at my TV.)

the boys will learn the difference between regular and post season, but I beg them, please stop getting embarrassed doing it 

It's so frustrating because you know they are capable of better, you know they can do this. 

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

4 hours ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

I am going to caveat the rest of this post by first saying , this fvcking sucks and I hate it. Why the fvcking Rangers, of all teams, to come along and crush this group of guys. 

 

With that out the way, I have to say I am not totally surprised this is happening. I didn't expect us to look so completely lost, but I was expecting this to be rough. 

The coaches we have are not skilled tacticians, they are not great at reading the game. They miss so much obvious sh!t it's infuriating, BUT I do have faith that they will at least make sure the young guys take lessons  from this nightmare and develop. And that's what they are here to do, and that's what I am bearing in mind, and that's why I am not going totally insane. 

To me it feels like we are the 2017-18 Colorado Avalanche, we have turned the team around we have a lot of our core peices in place, they are developing in the right direction, things are looking good and we have just run into a team in win now mode who have been there before. 

This is going to be a massive eye opener for the young guys, as it should be. I know it's a tired cliche but its been boys against men. 

I think Lindy needs to be brave now and get Luke and Schimd on the ice and get them some playoff experience. If we are going to go out, at least make the most of the opportunity to get something out of it so the next time it comes round everyone can say "this isn't new, I have done this before, I know what it takes". 

I haven't given up hope, but we need to be practical about what we can take from this to make sure it doesn't happen again on a year's time. 

It should also be very clear to Fitz now about who has run their race in this team and what sort of players we should be looking at in the off-season and at the deadline next year. 

I was going to post VERY similar sentiments, so I'll just piggyback onto this excellent post.

As much as I'm hating every last minute of this, if I look hard enough for any silver linings, here's what I find:

1) As you alluded to, the kids are very much learning the hardest way possible that the playoffs are indeed an ENTIRELY different kind of beast.  Yes, this group absolutely took a massive step forward this year and that shouldn't be minimized or forgotten, but there's obviously still many more to be taken.  If it takes this kind of decimation at the hands of their bitter rivals to get that message across loud and clear, as much as I hate it right this second, I'll eventually find some way to live with it.  Hopefully in 3-4 years we're looking back at this as the most painful but still necessary lesson needed for the Devils to continue to make real progress.  At the very least, the taste in their mouths will be so sour and impossible to wash out that this will stick with them and have them determined never to get squashed like this ever again.

2) Hopefully Fitz realizes that, unlike his predecessor, sticking with a meh head coach just because you feel some personal attachment to him is really bad idea.  Whatever Lindy had the ability to do here, he's already done it.  He's taken the Devils as far as he can.  He can go out as the guy who "led" the biggest single-season turnaround in NHL history; I still don't think he had all that much to do with it...I think a batch of talented kids taking inevitable steps forward AND Fitz making some fine moves to improve the roster were the far more significant contributors.  If he stays much longer, he's going to get in the way even more than he already does.  Just like certain players have shown that they're not meant to be a part of this thing going forward, the same holds true for Lindy.  

 

On a side note, just like we can look at Palms and be glad that Fitz got out from under him at just the right time...sadly I get the feeling Tampa and their fans see the exact same thing when they look at Palat.  I really hope he has more left than he's shown here to date.  And doubly sadly, re:  the bolded, I think Palat was supposed to be one of those "perfect guys for where this team is going" kind of acquisitions.

And man does Bratt look like one of those solid regular season performers who disappears or is relatively easy to neutralize come playoff time.  Not sure how much Fitz should really be willing to pony up to keep him long term...certainly not Jack or Nico money.  

Edited April 21, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[jagknife]

2 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

 

2) Hopefully Fitz realizes that, unlike his predecessor, sticking with a meh head coach just because you feel some personal attachment to him is really bad idea.  Whatever Lindy had the ability to do here, he's already done it.  He's taken the Devils as far as he can.  He can go out as the guy who "led" the biggest single-season turnaround in NHL history; I still don't think he had all that much to do with it...I think a batch of talented kids taking inevitable steps forward AND Fitz making some fine moves to improve the roster were the far more significant contributors.  If he stays much longer, he's going to get in the way even more than he already does.  Just like certain players have shown that they're not meant to be a part of this thing going forward, the same holds true for Lindy.  

 

On a side note, just like we can look at Palms and be glad that Fitz got out from under him at just the right time...sadly I get the feeling Tampa and their fans see the exact same thing when they look at Palat.  I really hope he has more left than he's shown here to date.  And doubly sadly, re:  the bolded, I think Palat was supposed to be one of those "perfect guys for where this team is going" kind of acquisitions.

And man does Bratt look like one of those solid regular season performers who disappears or is relatively easy to neutralize come playoff time.  Not sure how much Fitz should really be willing to pony up to keep him long term...certainly not Jack or Nico money.  

Regarding Palat: he did have major surgery and then got his face/teeth messed up. We all saw the night and day difference for Dougie with his jaw, so I’m willing to give Palat another year before I start to really worry.

but to your 2) point, something I didn’t consider: maybe NOW we are a desirable team to coach since we have clear hope and promise and aren’t just saying words to make fans feel better. Sure back when we hired the old man, we had dreams of this team being good again, but now we really are there. We need a leader and a system to match it. Let Ruff ride into the sunset, Fitz, go get us a champion (if any are out there)

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

35 minutes ago, jagknife said:

Regarding Palat: he did have major surgery and then got his face/teeth messed up. We all saw the night and day difference for Dougie with his jaw, so I’m willing to give Palat another year before I start to really worry.

but to your 2) point, something I didn’t consider: maybe NOW we are a desirable team to coach since we have clear hope and promise and aren’t just saying words to make fans feel better. Sure back when we hired the old man, we had dreams of this team being good again, but now we really are there. We need a leader and a system to match it. Let Ruff ride into the sunset, Fitz, go get us a champion (if any are out there)

Re:  the bolded, sure hope so, I think he was supposed to a nice veteran all-arounder...good for 50-55 points, leadership, intangibles, etc.  Devils are going to need something closer to that from him next year and beyond.

Yeah, I don't kid myself about how and why Lindy got the gig...top candidates weren't yet convinced about the Devils' future, and ownership wasn't quite fully ready to spend big money on head coach.  I think both scenarios have changed enough that the next coach won't be coming from the bargain bin.  Just hope Fitz recognizes that Lindy is SO not the guy to be in charge going forward.  

Edited April 21, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976

[Chimaira_Devil_#9]

51 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said:

I was going to post VERY similar sentiments, so I'll just piggyback onto this excellent post.

As much as I'm hating every last minute of this, if I look hard enough for any silver linings, here's what I find:

1) As you alleded to, the kids are very much learning the hardest way possible that the playoffs are indeed an ENTIRELY different kind of beast.  Yes, this group absolutely took a massive step forward this year and that shouldn't be minimized or forgotten, but there's obviously still many more to be taken.  If it takes this kind of decimation at the hands of their bitter rivals to get that message across loud and clear, as much as I hate it right this second, I'll eventually find some way to live with it.  Hopefully in 3-4 years we're looking back at this as the most painful but still necessary lesson needed for the Devils to continue to make real progress.  At the very least, the taste in their mouths will be so sour and impossible to wash out that this will stick with them and have them determined never to get squashed like this ever again.

2) Hopefully Fitz realizes that, unlike his predecessor, sticking with a meh head coach just because you feel some personal attachment to him is really bad idea.  Whatever Lindy had the ability to do here, he's already done it.  He's taken the Devils as far as he can.  He can go out as the guy who "led" the biggest single-season turnaround in NHL history; I still don't think he had all that much to do with it...I think a batch of talented kids taking inevitable steps forward AND Fitz making some fine moves to improve the roster were the far more significant contributors.  If he stays much longer, he's going to get in the way even more than he already does.  Just like certain players have shown that they're not meant to be a part of this thing going forward, the same holds true for Lindy.  

 

On a side note, just like we can look at Palms and be glad that Fitz got out from under him at just the right time...sadly I get the feeling Tampa and their fans see the exact same thing when they look at Palat.  I really hope he has more left than he's shown here to date.  And doubly sadly, re:  the bolded, I think Palat was supposed to be one of those "perfect guys for where this team is going" kind of acquisitions.

And man does Bratt look like one of those solid regular season performers who disappears or is relatively easy to neutralize come playoff time.  Not sure how much Fitz should really be willing to pony up to keep him long term...certainly not Jack or Nico money.  

I am not giving up on Palat yet. New team, big injury, lots of changes. I am hoping a bit more stability and a full off-season will take care of that. His points/60 was only marginally down on his last year with Tampa. And that was consistent with his career number. 

Now Bratt, there is a different story. He seems to have coasted through the second half of the season and into the playoffs. I think he has hit his ceiling on terms of what we can expect, think he is a 60-70 point player. 

If you look at forwards who scored between 70-75 points last year he is already the 9th best paid player in the league. The guys above him include Gaudreau, Ovechkin and Kopitar. I would say the nearest comparable player who has signed is Kevin Fiala whos AAV is $7.8 million. I think if Bratt is looking north of $7.5 million you walk. 

[andy]

Can you think of a series where a team looked as bad as the Devils at home and come back to win?

[Colorado Rockies 1976]

23 minutes ago, Chimaira_Devil_#9 said:

I am not giving up on Palat yet. New team, big injury, lots of changes. I am hoping a bit more stability and a full off-season will take care of that. His points/60 was only marginally down on his last year with Tampa. And that was consistent with his career number. 

Now Bratt, there is a different story. He seems to have coasted through the second half of the season and into the playoffs. I think he has hit his ceiling on terms of what we can expect, think he is a 60-70 point player. 

If you look at forwards who scored between 70-75 points last year he is already the 9th best paid player in the league. The guys above him include Gaudreau, Ovechkin and Kopitar. I would say the nearest comparable player who has signed is Kevin Fiala whos AAV is $7.8 million. I think if Bratt is looking north of $7.5 million you walk. 

Re:  Bratt, I'd say 65-75 points per 82 GP will be about his rate going forward, but as we know, he can look like a complete beast at times, and incredibly disengaged at other times.  He brings production but with considerable flaws.  I don't think he'll be any better than he is right now...I think from here on out, this is what you can expect to get from him...if he ever turns in a subpar year, fans will turn on him quickly because it will look and feel like he doesn't give a damn.  

Of course if the Devils don't keep him, they gotta replace him, and as we well know, guys who can put 73 points two straight seasons aren't THAT easy to find (and it doesn't appear that the Devils have that a "from within" replacement to take his spot).  This one's tricky.  But if it comes down to a choice between him and Meier, I probably keep Meier...I can see Bratt putting up more points, but I can see Timo bringing more grit and other intangibles. 

[devlman]

12 hours ago, MadDog2020 said:

Scratching Siegenthaler for Smith was really brilliant too. Just a genius move.

Lindy actually dumbfoundingly said Smith played well. fvck my life.