GDT - Jerseys Team vs New York 1994's

[Satans Hockey]

25 minutes ago, MadDog2020 said:

Cake, great read brother. You managed to sum up my feelings on Rag fans from NJ quite well there... You nailed why the rivalry is so intense and so unique. Props to you sir.

I definitely agree with a lot of what he wrote. I'm on the opposite side of the story being a Devils fan from Staten Island, but all of my close family was born and raised in New Jersey, I have worked in New Jersey for pretty much my entire working life and other then spending time at my home I spend the majority of my time doing things in New Jersey. My first game was a Devils game because my cousin from New Jersey took me there and I've been hooked ever since. While I still say I'm from Staten Island I still consider New Jersey part of my home. It also only takes me about 25 minutes to get to the arena as well. 

While the majority here are horrible Rangers fans there are quite a number of Devils season tickets holders from Staten Island as well.

If I ever end up moving New Jersey would be the only place I would end up. 

Edited February 25, 2016 by Satans Hockey

[Steven M.]

18 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

I'm not even sure it was as bad, I had the same reaction at first. They filled in a lot of seats in the lower bowl, but it seemed to me on tv when they showed the entire arena after goals that there was definitely more red. Also the Devils crowd was immensely louder. Someone who was there would know better. But considering the New York sports market is the largest in the continent and Prudential Center being less than 10 miles from that border, it's amazing that these proportions are the largest Rangers groups we've seen in years.

 

I actually thought the same thing after watching highlights for the 100th time today. Seemed like it looked better on TV. At the game though, felt like I was surrounded by them and when they scored those two goals it felt like everyone in the building was standing up. Obviously some hyperbole on that last part, and I don't think they actually outumbered us but it was definitely far worse than I can remember at any game I've been to between the two teams.

 

by the way, awesome article you wrote. thanks for that.

[devilsfan26]

14 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

I did a piece on the Devils-Rangers rivalry for New York Puck. It might resonate with some people here, maybe not with others.

 

From the West Side of the Hudson River Rivalry

The last essay I wrote in college was about this topic (I majored in sport management and minored in geography), but you wrote it out much better than I did.  I agree 100%.  This is more than just sports rivalry, this is a geographical rivalry mixed with a community's identity crisis.

[mfitz804]

I think a lot of Devils fans spend a lot more time than nevessary worrying about how Rangers fans think and act. I personally could care less, as they are doing what they are supposed to do, showing blind loyalty to their team. I don't need a reason to love the Devils, they are my team, they've been my team since the first time I saw hockey, and they'll always be my team.

When Rangers fans complain about "the trap", I know it's because it frustrated them that their team couldn't find a way through it. Talking about how a "scrub team with no offense" beat them 3 out of 4 this year, I mean is that statement THAT far off? Is there anyone who doesn't think we've over performed this season?

Our leading scorer is a veteran re-tread making less than a million bucks this year. Maybe it's insulting to be called scrubs, but in the end, the answer is yeah, we have no true first line offensive players at the moment and we just dropped 5 on your ass, and you are lucky Lundqvist has enough left in the tank that it wasn't 8 or 9. So who's the scrubs really? 

With that logic in mind, I can just disregard the Rangers' fan opinions. Like I said, they are supposed to hate us and say negative things about us, just like we do to them. That's why we chant Rangers Suck whether they are in the building or they are not. 

[DevsMan84]

22 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

I did a piece on the Devils-Rangers rivalry for New York Puck. It might resonate with some people here, maybe not with others.

 

From the West Side of the Hudson River Rivalry

This is really rich.

Here you go getting bent out of shape over what other people put on their cars by writing this gem:

"When I see a car with Jersey plates and a Rangers sticker or people in Jersey flying Rangers flags outside of their houses, I do take their support as somewhat of a personal affront. I wonder how they can care so little about where they are from that they identify with a different community; again, a community we as New Jerseyans have tried so hard to distinguish ourselves from. These fans perpetuate the narrative that New Jersey is not a culturally unique place, and it is not a community people identify with. We perceive their very existence as insulting and damaging, and that is what elevates this rivalry."

 

Yet from this post last year when I spoke out against people wearing fake jerseys, you basically wrote that I should mind my fvcking business.

"You jersey people are ridiculous. You sound like the brats who were mad at your parents on Christmas for getting you the wrong brand of the thing you asked for. Who do you guys think you are to criticize the things people wear to games? If you want me in an authentic jersey at the arena, PM me for my address, and I'll gladly take one from you. Until then, I'm going to continue wearing the knock off Brodeur jersey my Flyers fan buddy got me for my birthday a few years ago."

http://njdevs.com/forums/index.php?/topic/134767-adidas-gets-nhl-jersey-deal-starts-17-18-advertising-on-jerseys-poss/&page=3

How about take some of your own advice and stop caring and criticizing what people put on their cars and maybe you will get less upset.

 

[thecoffeecake]

1 hour ago, DevsMan84 said:

This is really rich.

Here you go getting bent out of shape over what other people put on their cars by writing this gem:

"When I see a car with Jersey plates and a Rangers sticker or people in Jersey flying Rangers flags outside of their houses, I do take their support as somewhat of a personal affront. I wonder how they can care so little about where they are from that they identify with a different community; again, a community we as New Jerseyans have tried so hard to distinguish ourselves from. These fans perpetuate the narrative that New Jersey is not a culturally unique place, and it is not a community people identify with. We perceive their very existence as insulting and damaging, and that is what elevates this rivalry."

 

Yet from this post last year when I spoke out against people wearing fake jerseys, you basically wrote that I should mind my fvcking business.

"You jersey people are ridiculous. You sound like the brats who were mad at your parents on Christmas for getting you the wrong brand of the thing you asked for. Who do you guys think you are to criticize the things people wear to games? If you want me in an authentic jersey at the arena, PM me for my address, and I'll gladly take one from you. Until then, I'm going to continue wearing the knock off Brodeur jersey my Flyers fan buddy got me for my birthday a few years ago."

http://njdevs.com/forums/index.php?/topic/134767-adidas-gets-nhl-jersey-deal-starts-17-18-advertising-on-jerseys-poss/&page=3

How about take some of your own advice and stop caring and criticizing what people put on their cars and maybe you will get less upset.

 

If you think these two subjects are in the same ballpark, you either completely missed the point of the article or just don't experience this rivalry the same way I do, which is fine. I said in my initial post that it wouldn't hit for everyone. The point isn't about what people put on their cars, it's the symbolic relationship between someone from New Jersey and their cultural identity. If this doesn't go as far for you as someone's Chinese knockoff jersey having a slightly askew letter, we show up to the rink for far different reasons.

Thanks for all the good words, everyone. This piece ended up being bigger than anything I thought I'd ever write.

[Satans Hockey]

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up. 

[hit the post]

22 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up.

I agree......just as my two now grown kids are huge Devils fans. Before the Devils its was either the Rangers or the Flyers.

 

[thecoffeecake]

40 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up. 

It wasn't there. I took a paragraph on that out. To me, it's irrelevant. I know it's an influencing factor, but it doesn't make their presence here any better. Whether I grew up in a Rangers family or not, I am a proud New Jerseyan. It would eat away at me every day, and I would've come over eventually. I think the same people who would drop their MLB team if one came to Jersey are the same ones that would eventually drop the Rangers if they were raised in a Rangers household. It's also the perspective you see professional sports from. For me, it's about community (clearly). For others I fully understand that's not the biggest thing for them, and allegiances to one specific team, whether they be where you live or not, is a bigger factor. I personally wouldn't follow whatever the Devils became if they left the state, just like I didn't follow the Nets. I know some of you are different, and would remain a fan or did remain Nets fans.

 

I've always said without the factor of community in professional sports, everything is just a game. What's beautiful about it for me is that it's so much more than a game.

[DevsMan84]

1 hour ago, thecoffeecake said:

If you think these two subjects are in the same ballpark, you either completely missed the point of the article or just don't experience this rivalry the same way I do, which is fine. I said in my initial post that it wouldn't hit for everyone. The point isn't about what people put on their cars, it's the symbolic relationship between someone from New Jersey and their cultural identity. If this doesn't go as far for you as someone's Chinese knockoff jersey having a slightly askew letter, we show up to the rink for far different reasons.

Thanks for all the good words, everyone. This piece ended up being bigger than anything I thought I'd ever write.

 

lol of course the reply I figured you would make is what you made.

Yeah my being irritated by knockoffs is totally not in the same ballpark as you being irritated by seeing Rangers stickers on cars.  Yup, mine is completely silly and stupid and yours is completely rational.  Oh I forgot, yours is rational because as you say it has to do with some sort of symbolism about state pride and cultural identity.  Give me a break.  If I said that knockoffs are a symbolism to hurting the team by that the team gets hurt by the sales of them since they get no royalties and basically a giant middle finger to the team you claim you love, I would totally get the hissy fit like the one you threw at me over in that thread that I linked to.

I go to the rink to watch the team I love and to meet with people and friends I have met over the years who go to game as well.  I don't go for state pride or any nonsense existential reason.

[thecoffeecake]

2 minutes ago, DevsMan84 said:

 

lol of course the reply I figured you would make is what you made.

Yeah my being irritated by knockoffs is totally not in the same ballpark as you being irritated by seeing Rangers stickers on cars.  Yup, mine is completely silly and stupid and yours is completely rational.  Oh I forgot, yours is rational because as you say it has to do with some sort of symbolism about state pride and cultural identity.  Give me a break.  If I said that knockoffs are a symbolism to hurting the team by that the team gets hurt by the sales of them since they get no royalties and basically a giant middle finger to the team you claim you love, I would totally get the hissy fit like the one you threw at me over in that thread that I linked to.

I go to the rink to watch the team I love and to meet with people and friends I have met over the years who go to game as well.  I don't go for state pride or any nonsense existential reason.

Yea, I somehow think cultural identity has more weight than what website you bought a shirt from.

We're on different pages, that's fine. Some people like sports for sports, and for some people it goes beyond that as a cultural expression.

[DevsMan84]

24 minutes ago, thecoffeecake said:

Yea, I somehow think cultural identity has more weight than what website you bought a shirt from.

We're on different pages, that's fine. Some people like sports for sports, and for some people it goes beyond that as a cultural expression.

 

1 minute ago, DevsMan84 said:

My expression is through jerseys.  I make no bones about it and make no bones that for a lot of people they could care less about them. 

Yours is finding state pride (or lack thereof) in people putting stickers on their cars and others who support a bunch of paid professional athletes playing on a team that can threaten to move to a different state because they want a better lease deal at their arena (see McMullen 1995).  Some state pride the Devils were showing their own fans and NJ then.

Mine is still somehow petty and silly and yours is perfectly fine and rational.  I guess I will just have to live with that it seems.

 

Edited February 25, 2016 by DevsMan84

[squishyx]

2 hours ago, Satans Hockey said:

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up. 

As a Devils fan born and raised in NY this is my story. My Uncle and cousin were Devils fans, they were the first team I was introduced too so I followed suit. I always find the "you owe your state's team your allegiance" posts a little disappointing, I think you guys forget you have some "state traitors" rooting for this team too 

[MadDog2020]

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up. 

Garbage excuse. My mother was a Rag fan back in the day- hell she WORKED at MSG in the late 60's and early 70's. When I found out at 6 years old that we had an NHL team here in NJ, I immediately asked my parents to take me to a game, and the rest is history... And because of me, my mom converted to the Devils for good in 1988. So I've never bought that dumb excuse 'oh my dad was a Ranger fan'. Who the fvck cares? You're from NJ. fvcking act like it.

[Satans Hockey]

1 hour ago, MadDog2020 said:

Garbage excuse. My mother was a Rag fan back in the day- hell she WORKED at MSG in the late 60's and early 70's. When I found out at 6 years old that we had an NHL team here in NJ, I immediately asked my parents to take me to a game, and the rest is history... And because of me, my mom converted to the Devils for good in 1988. So I've never bought that dumb excuse 'oh my dad was a Ranger fan'. Who the fvck cares? You're from NJ. fvcking act like it.

Well squishy and me are both NY Devils fans. I don't know where he lives but Staten Island might as well be Jersey anyway for myself lol so I at least understand why the aspect of growing up a fan of a team that isn't actually your state. 

Im really interested to see what the games are like in 20 years when we have even more generation to generation families of Devils fans.

[thecoffeecake]

4 hours ago, DevsMan84 said:

My expression is through jerseys.  I make no bones about it and make no bones that for a lot of people they could care less about them. 

Yours is finding state pride (or lack thereof) in people putting stickers on their cars and others who support a bunch of paid professional athletes playing on a team that can threaten to move to a different state because they want a better lease deal at their arena (see McMullen 1995).  Some state pride the Devils were showing their own fans and NJ then.

Mine is still somehow petty and silly and yours is perfectly fine and rational.  I guess I will just have to live with that it seems.

I think I've explained pretty succinctly the problem I have with Rangers fans in Jersey. I get that jerseys are your thing, but what I don't understand is what problem you have with people that wear knockoffs. Please explain to me how these things are equatable so I can understand your perspective on this.

[thecoffeecake]

10 minutes ago, Satans Hockey said:

Well squishy and me are both NY Devils fans. I don't know where he lives but Staten Island might as well be Jersey anyway for myself lol so I at least understand why the aspect of growing up a fan of a team that isn't actually your state. 

Im really interested to see what the games are like in 20 years when we have even more generation to generation families of Devils fans.

It's just a little different as I outlined in the article. There are always people who choose a local rival team, but the difference is that New York doesn't have the cultural identity issue New Jersey deals with. No one thinks New York is just an extension of New Jersey and that no one cares about their sports teams because everyone identifies culturally with New Jersey. It's not necessarily a bad thing to support a team you don't have a cultural connection with, although I don't understand it, but New Jersey is an exceptional case. I think it's the responsibility of people from here to be flag bearers for our state and culture. I don't think that kind of responsibility lies as heavily on individuals from New York, Philly, or Boston. The only other cases I can think are even slightly similar would be Long Island, Anaheim, and maybe Ottawa. I'd listen to arguments about Oakland, too.

[squishyx]

1 hour ago, Satans Hockey said:

Well squishy and me are both NY Devils fans. I don't know where he lives but Staten Island might as well be Jersey anyway for myself lol so I at least understand why the aspect of growing up a fan of a team that isn't actually your state. 

Im really interested to see what the games are like in 20 years when we have even more generation to generation families of Devils fans.

Ha! I'm from "upstate" New York but they live in Staten Island, theory checks out!  I don't think I ever asked my uncle why he is a Devils fan (my cousin has since switched allegiances to the Rangers), I suspect it had something to do with the Meadow Lands being closer than MSG?

[devilsfan26]

11 hours ago, Satans Hockey said:

I think a major factor that you left out in your piece unless I missed it is that a lot of Rangers fans in Jersey are fans of them because of their families being Rangers fans before the Devils were even here or before more people jumped on the fan base as the team was getting good. The team your father, grandfather have a huge influence on a lot of the kids growing up. 

Welp as former NJDevs poster, DaneykoIsGod, put it, "Your dad also fvcked your mom, are those the footsteps you want to follow?"

[DevsMan84]

14 hours ago, thecoffeecake said:

I think I've explained pretty succinctly the problem I have with Rangers fans in Jersey. I get that jerseys are your thing, but what I don't understand is what problem you have with people that wear knockoffs. Please explain to me how these things are equatable so I can understand your perspective on this.

Oh god.  Why even attempt to when no matter what I say you are just going to reply with "well mine is still more important/understandable because I said so" or something along those lines.

In the grand scheme of things, both don't mean a hell of a lot and to many are really silly.  However, at least I can admit that the jersey thing is not a huge deal to a vast majority of the masses (which I have done so countless times in many threads), while you want to turn Rangers bumper stickers on cars in NJ into something a hell of a lot bigger than it is and as some sort of attack of state pride and personal affront to you.  Therefore in your mind your issue is always going to be vastly more important in the jerseys.

 

Edited February 26, 2016 by DevsMan84

[thecoffeecake]

On 2/26/2016 at 10:15 AM, DevsMan84 said:

Oh god.  Why even attempt to when no matter what I say you are just going to reply with "well mine is still more important/understandable because I said so" or something along those lines.

In the grand scheme of things, both don't mean a hell of a lot and to many are really silly.  However, at least I can admit that the jersey thing is not a huge deal to a vast majority of the masses (which I have done so countless times in many threads), while you want to turn Rangers bumper stickers on cars in NJ into something a hell of a lot bigger than it is and as some sort of attack of state pride and personal affront to you.  Therefore in your mind your issue is always going to be vastly more important in the jerseys.

 

The issue of cultural identity isn't a more serious issue because I say so. Cultural identity has drawn international borders, been responsible for the rise of countless world leaders and led to countless wars. It's something that's far from "pretty silly", I'd say. Your constant assertion that this is a matter of subjectivity and perception just seems like a willing ignorance in an attempt to settle a year old grudge. Jerseys are your thing, and that's great, but how many times can you say that these things belong in the same conversation without it starting to sound ridiculous to you?

[NJDevs4978]

To me it's even more ridiculous to be holding a grudge over a year-old post to the point of waiting to drop it into an unrelated point/thread to start an argument than it is to actually care about knockoff jerseys or Ranger fans in Jersey.  If you don't respect someone 84 then put them on ignore instead of cluttering up the board with personal attacks (again).  If you don't agree with his point that's fine.  But his post wasn't about jerseys, at least stick to the topic instead of dredging up a game thread/recap with old arguments and attacks.

And so I'm not accused of being one-sided I do think it was a mistake to leave out in the piece growing up in Ranger fan families as being a huge, unavoidable factor in there still being many Ranger fans in Jersey and as annoying as it can be I think it's certainly a valid excuse.  Yes some people 'rebel' and become Devil fans but many like the camraderie of shared experience and I can't fault people for defaulting to that.  On the other hand I don't particularly like Devil fans taking Ranger fan friends to the Rock (family's another story), but that's of course bias cause a lot more Ranger fans come to the Rock already as it is.

Edited February 29, 2016 by NJDevs4978

[mfitz804]

On February 26, 2016 at 0:13 AM, devilsfan26 said:

Welp as former NJDevs poster, DaneykoIsGod, put it, "Your dad also fvcked your mom, are those the footsteps you want to follow?"

That's possibly the best quote ever. 

[SterioDesign]

On February 26, 2016 at 11:15 AM, DevsMan84 said:

Oh god.  Why even attempt to when no matter what I say you are just going to reply with "well mine is still more important/understandable because I said so" or something along those lines.

In the grand scheme of things, both don't mean a hell of a lot and to many are really silly.  However, at least I can admit that the jersey thing is not a huge deal to a vast majority of the masses (which I have done so countless times in many threads), while you want to turn Rangers bumper stickers on cars in NJ into something a hell of a lot bigger than it is and as some sort of attack of state pride and personal affront to you.  Therefore in your mind your issue is always going to be vastly more important in the jerseys.

 

You nailed it there. That poster jumped on me cause i'm not a fan "from NJ" so i was not allowed or worthy to have an opinion or voice my opinion about anything related to NJ that i've heard about or read online.

There's clearly an issue when someone is on the defence all the time like that 

[devilsfan26]

4 hours ago, mfitz804 said:

That's possibly the best quote ever. 

Haha actually I think his exact words were, "Your dad also fvcked your mom and you're not chomping at the bit to follow in those footsteps...or are you?  Ew."