Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) 4 hours ago, Puckbuster said: Yeah, but I also said they are only 2 points behind the Pens and 3 behind the Caps. You said they are “without a doubt a bottom 3 team in the division” with over two months to go. That is like saying, the Avs are without a doubt a wild card team. That would ridiculous to say. Are they the wagon like last year? I would say no, because they were getting timely goaltending and losing Kadri was huge, but they are still cup contenders. None of us know how anything will play out and most is conjecture, speculation, gut feeling, etc. I responded to your post respectfully and with points to back up my opinion, outlook, assessment, whatever, and I get back the look of confusion? Despite the “current” standings and how teams are currently constructed, I don’t think the Islanders are bottom 3 team. Without Horvat they are a very capable team to take a wild card spot and with Horvat, in my most humble opinion, makes them more than capable. Could that change, yes. Could I be wrong? Hell yes. Is anyone else’s outlook without a doubt accurate? fvck no. Injuries, future acquisitions or a team or two that gets hot down the stretch could change all that. Re: standings, it’s fair to point out that two teams ahead of them (the Penguins and Sabres) have three games in hand on the Isles. That hurts. Edited January 31, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Patrick Sundstrom Ghost Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 I don't think this was a bad trade by Lou, and I am one of those folks who was over Lou when others still drank the Kool Aid, so yeah I quite like the deal for the Islanders. They basically traded there own Zacha, a kid who dropped like an anchor to the second round when his minus 1 draft year he was one of the top players and a draft pick top 12 protected. so yeah not very much. They are an old team, but a lot of their best players including probably the best goalie in the game are not old, and now they added another core piece who is also not old who will probably resign with them as his agent represents like 4 or 5 players on the team so Lou probably has a decent idea on how the guy thinks and if it was smart to trade for another of his clients. They are a team who still needs a big time younger wing, but those are hard to find and that team is in a place where they could be a good team but unless things go great not a great team. This trade gives them a chance of being a better team, while still not great it does improve their awful powerplay and makes them much improved down the middle. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) The best thing about this deal is that it was made early enough that if the Isles clearly aren’t making the playoffs, Lou has time to trade Horvat again and get a return. I definitely don’t see Horvat being a lock to stay. The Isles core seems firmly stuck in “Pretty Good” territory…we may have already seen their best. I’d be surprised if he didn’t at least test the waters to see what else is out there. This is one of those times that Lou should definitely start the conversations and get an idea as to how interested Horvat might be in sticking around. Edited January 31, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
vadvlfan Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 We all know Devil fans will be pissed at Fitz if he doesn't land Timo. Devils are competing w/ teams willing to give up a lot as well. I think fans should lower their expectations. If a deal for Meier is made we all know $$$ has to go the other way. For me, if we can't out bid for Timo, I'll be satisfied with another fw. I think we have a very decent d corp. (veteran). This "c'mon Fitz do it already" stuff is common with all fans. In Fitz we trust. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) 1 hour ago, vadvlfan said: We all know Devil fans will be pissed at Fitz if he doesn't land Timo. Devils are competing w/ teams willing to give up a lot as well. I think fans should lower their expectations. If a deal for Meier is made we all know $$$ has to go the other way. For me, if we can't out bid for Timo, I'll be satisfied with another fw. I think we have a very decent d corp. (veteran). This "c'mon Fitz do it already" stuff is common with all fans. In Fitz we trust. Yeah I don't think it's the end of the world if Fitz winds up pivoting to a guy like Henrique or a couple of mid-tier guys. Not saying that I don't want Meier, but yeah, only one team is going to land him, and it could get to be costly. That's why I wonder if Mercer could potentially be a part of this thing. I pretty much assume Holtz, Casey, and this year's first-rounder are locks to go the other way in any deal for Meier. If the Devils somehow made a deal of Sharangovich, Holtz, Casey, a first-rounder and Walsh for Meier, I'd consider that a win. Five assets sounds like a lot, but Rango's pretty much playing his way out of the Devils' plans, and Walsh is a throw-in who the Sharks can take a look at to see if he's more than just a good AHLer...there's no room for him here. The big gets for the Sharks are obviously Holtz, Casey, and the first-rounder. And the big gets for the Devils are Meier and not having to give up Mercer or Nemec (L Hughes is obviously as untouchable as it gets). You're not really giving up much off the 2022-23 Devils. Edited January 31, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringtwins Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 Id like Blackwood, Holtz and next years first for him. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
2ELIAS6 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 4 minutes ago, ringtwins said: Id like Blackwood, Holtz and next years first for him. What makes you think they would want Blackwood? … that is surely not enough for an extended Meier. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ringtwins Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) Blackwood is a "great" goalie, some in the league would say. Not me Edited January 31, 2023 by ringtwins Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 21 minutes ago, ringtwins said: Id like Blackwood, Holtz and next years first for him. Absolutely no way that gets it done. We’re going to have to give up a player we actually like to land Meier. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 (edited) 24 minutes ago, ringtwins said: Blackwood is a "great" goalie, some in the league would say. Not me No one says that...he did show potential of being consistently above average during his first two seasons, but any team thinking that he might regain that form (and be able to stay healthy, which has also become a problem for him) is taking a serious leap of faith. He looks like he's settling into being a journeyman backup, once his time here is done. 30 minutes ago, ringtwins said: Id like Blackwood, Holtz and next years first for him. That's never happening. Gotta give to get. The good news is that it looks like the Devils are just deep enough in prospects that they have a real shot to land Meier without giving up any key "right now" pieces. If it came down to Dawson being a part of any deals for Meier I'd absolutely have to consider it, but I'd rather not. I'd like to see if there's a way to bring in Meier and still hang on to Dawson...to do that, you gotta give up some quality AND quantity. That's why I proposed 5-for-1, with some key boxes still being checked off for the Sharks. Edited January 31, 2023 by Colorado Rockies 1976 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guadana Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 3 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puckbuster Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 7 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said: Re: standings, it’s fair to point out that two teams ahead of them (the Penguins and Sabres) have three games in hand on the Isles. That hurts. Yes, I understand everything that has been said about the Islanders not making the playoffs. However, it is only two points and to catch up on teams that are not exactly the pillar of stability. There is two months to go. Let’s see how things go. It looks like there will be races and battles up down the standings for the top spots and wc. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 6 minutes ago, Puckbuster said: Yes, I understand everything that has been said about the Islanders not making the playoffs. However, it is only two points and to catch up on teams that are not exactly the pillar of stability. There is two months to go. Let’s see how things go. It looks like there will be races and battles up down the standings for the top spots and wc. Yes it's only two points and I'm not saying that the Islanders are dead and buried and absolutely will NOT make the playoffs, but three games in hand (with those teams already ahead of you, even if it's only by a couple of points) isn't insignificant. You can't just leave that part out when talking about them being "close"...that's absolutely part of the picture here. And the Isles are just 10-14-5 in their last 29 games...and as of late have barely been scoring at all, even in wins (22 goals in their last 13 GP). Yeah, they just got Horvat, but is that going to be enough? Does Lou have enough assets to make another "Right Now" move? They really need to go on a run very soon. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puckbuster Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 8 hours ago, Patrick Sundstrom Ghost said: I don't think this was a bad trade by Lou, and I am one of those folks who was over Lou when others still drank the Kool Aid, so yeah I quite like the deal for the Islanders. They basically traded there own Zacha, a kid who dropped like an anchor to the second round when his minus 1 draft year he was one of the top players and a draft pick top 12 protected. so yeah not very much. They are an old team, but a lot of their best players including probably the best goalie in the game are not old, and now they added another core piece who is also not old who will probably resign with them as his agent represents like 4 or 5 players on the team so Lou probably has a decent idea on how the guy thinks and if it was smart to trade for another of his clients. They are a team who still needs a big time younger wing, but those are hard to find and that team is in a place where they could be a good team but unless things go great not a great team. This trade gives them a chance of being a better team, while still not great it does improve their awful powerplay and makes them much improved down the middle. I agree and that is why I think they are a potential wild card team at best. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puckbuster Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 19 minutes ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said: Yes it's only two points and I'm not saying that the Islanders are dead and buried and absolutely will NOT make the playoffs, but three games in hand (with those teams already ahead of you, even if it's only by a couple of points) isn't insignificant. You can't just leave that part out when talking about them being "close"...that's absolutely part of the picture here. And the Isles are just 10-14-5 in their last 29 games...and as of late have barely been scoring at all, even in wins (22 goals in their last 13 GP). Yeah, they just got Horvat, but is that going to be enough? Does Lou have enough assets to make another "Right Now" move? They really need to go on a run very soon. I never said it would be easy and I never said that they will not finish bottom 3, just saying the Islanders have a chance to take a we spot. I don’t think the teams they are competing against are that much better, but that could change with injuries, acquisitions, or just a team or two going cold. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
MadDog2020 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 Fitz was recently scouting Florida: https://thehockeywriters.com/devils-gm-fitzgerald-3-panthers-2023-trade-targets/?fbclid=IwAR1PYaL8cGSgv7BuWu3_BEYpLpAhYvS0MvVmcoUdIuDM-S-qDGann2jbITU&mibextid=Zxz2cZ 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Colorado Rockies 1976 Posted January 31, 2023 Share Posted January 31, 2023 4 minutes ago, Puckbuster said: I never said it would be easy and I never said that they will not finish bottom 3, just saying the Islanders have a chance to take a we spot. I don’t think the teams they are competing against are that much better, but that could change with injuries, acquisitions, or just a team or two going cold. And I never said that YOU said it would be easy or that YOU said that they will not finish in the bottom three. I said that you left out an important part of the equation (the Islanders having played more games than some of the teams they're battling for a WC berth), and that their lack of scoring (and the lackluster record as of late) is a concern. Also wondered aloud if Horvat will be enough...and if not, can Lou make another "right now" deal with what he has to work with? I guess the Isles have a chance at a WC (they do get terrific goaltending, and though Buffalo looks like they've turned a corner and can score plenty, Washington and Pittsburgh have been up-and-down), but even if they squeak in, are they making much noise? I'm not so sure going all-in at this particular time with this particular team was the best move...but like I said, it can also be interpreted as an "OK guys, I got you help, now show me that you deserve to have me hang onto him for the rest of the season! Because if you don't, I don't HAVE to keep him." kind of move. Lou did strike early at least...that does give him a rare "Undo" option. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 3 hours ago, MadDog2020 said: Fitz was recently scouting Florida: https://thehockeywriters.com/devils-gm-fitzgerald-3-panthers-2023-trade-targets/?fbclid=IwAR1PYaL8cGSgv7BuWu3_BEYpLpAhYvS0MvVmcoUdIuDM-S-qDGann2jbITU&mibextid=Zxz2cZ Also remember his son was claimed by the Panthers, granted was scratched that game. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Puckbuster Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 4 hours ago, Colorado Rockies 1976 said: And I never said that YOU said it would be easy or that YOU said that they will not finish in the bottom three. I said that you left out an important part of the equation (the Islanders having played more games than some of the teams they're battling for a WC berth), and that their lack of scoring (and the lackluster record as of late) is a concern. Also wondered aloud if Horvat will be enough...and if not, can Lou make another "right now" deal with what he has to work with? I guess the Isles have a chance at a WC (they do get terrific goaltending, and though Buffalo looks like they've turned a corner and can score plenty, Washington and Pittsburgh have been up-and-down), but even if they squeak in, are they making much noise? I'm not so sure going all-in at this particular time with this particular team was the best move...but like I said, it can also be interpreted as an "OK guys, I got you help, now show me that you deserve to have me hang onto him for the rest of the season! Because if you don't, I don't HAVE to keep him." kind of move. Lou did strike early at least...that does give him a rare "Undo" option. True, I should have included the games. Can Horvat provide enough production? He could or he could go cold. Either way he provided the team with another player that could take the pressure of someone like Barzal. Does he have anything in the cupboards to add? I don’t know what he has other than more picks. I’m not sure what the Islanders have in terms of prospects. Whether they make the playoffs or not, I think Lou has to do what he can to resign Horvat given what he has given up. If, he does and the team continues to flounder in mediocrity next season, Lou or the next GM will have the assets to go into full rebuild. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 13 minutes ago, Puckbuster said: True, I should have included the games. Can Horvat provide enough production? He could or he could go cold. Either way he provided the team with another player that could take the pressure of someone like Barzal. Does he have anything in the cupboards to add? I don’t know what he has other than more picks. I’m not sure what the Islanders have in terms of prospects. Whether they make the playoffs or not, I think Lou has to do what he can to resign Horvat given what he has given up. If, he does and the team continues to flounder in mediocrity next season, Lou or the next GM will have the assets to go into full rebuild. Not much. Raty was their #1 ranked prospect, and they just traded him away. 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevils1214 Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nicomo Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 40 minutes ago, NJDevils1214 said: If you need a good laugh just go online and look at some of the trade proposals from Habs fans for Josh Anderson. Especially the Devils related ones. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
NJDevils1214 Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 There is speculation, but only speculation, that Larkin rejected the most recent offer from Yzerman for 8x8. I think it is a long shot he walks, but if he does do you do it? He is a C, but....yea. He's out there so just a discussion. https://www.hockeyfeed.com/nhl-news/report-dylan-larkin-rejects-red-wings-contract-offer Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guadana Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 6 hours ago, Nicomo said: If you need a good laugh just go online and look at some of the trade proposals from Habs fans for Josh Anderson. Especially the Devils related ones. Let`s offer Walsh, Talvitie and 2nd pick for Meier on twitter. 4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jagknife Posted February 1, 2023 Share Posted February 1, 2023 34 minutes ago, Guadana said: Let`s offer Walsh, Talvitie and 2nd pick for Meier on twitter. I get EVERYONE over-values their own players, but what the hell is their obsession that Anderson is amazing to other teams? That's like us saying we should have received the same for Zacha 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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