Lou's Future

[NewarkDevil5]

Basically his methods and ideas are stuck in the past, he's not willing to adjust.

 

Even if they are stuck in the past, they are still a worthy influence. The new GM would likely still be inclined to make changes even with Lou's influence if only to make it know that this is now his team. That's natural. But to have that person be influenced by one of the most successful GM's of the last quarter century is definitely not a bad thing.

[William D'Aquila]

Basically his methods and ideas are stuck in the past, he's not willing to adjust.

 

What are his methods, and how is he not adjusting?

[Jerzey]

How did those moves set back the organization in any way?

 

What is wrong with Lou's influence? Explain further, and if your answer is that he missed the playoffs the last 3 years, I will rightly laugh at you.

I think this team could use a new direction. He's stuck in his defense first ways. Ive been watching this team since the late 80's. 3 years is nothing to me.

[SterioDesign]

What are his methods, and how is he not adjusting?

 

Are you serious? 

 

First it's so damn obvious and then i've point it out like 10,000 times, even in this very thread hours ago. And you still don't know? 

Even if they are stuck in the past, they are still a worthy influence. The new GM would likely still be inclined to make changes even with Lou's influence if only to make it know that this is now his team. That's natural. But to have that person be influenced by one of the most successful GM's of the last quarter century is definitely not a bad thing.

 

Of course not, many GMs around the league have learned from Lou and are not doing a better job than him cause they adjusted. There's certainly some stuff you can pick of Lou's brain but some of his ways has to go.

[William D'Aquila]

Are you serious? 

 

First it's so damn obvious and then i've point it out like 10,000 times, even in this very thread hours ago. And you still don't know? 

 

Of course not, many GMs around the league have learned from Lou and are not doing a better job than him cause they adjusted. There's certainly some stuff you can pick of Lou's brain but some of his ways has to go.

All you go on about is Zach Parise over and over again. You don't give a player coming off a major knee injury a longterm contract, nor do you trade a pending UFA when you are one of the best teams in the league during the 2nd half. 

[slasher72]

Lou tends to run things the ground and give full control to the players to walk or not, not protecting his assets at all, if they want to re-sign already well its no problem. But if they are on the fence, its guarantee they'll test the market or walk. Other GMs are not letting this happen.

 

- case in point, Scott Neidermeyer. Going to arbitration twice until he just said "F it" and went to Anaheim via free agency. 

 

 

 

I'm interested to see what he can pull off this off-season but the other side of me wishes we had someone else handling the draft other than Lou and Conte because their draft picks have been underwhelming, especially when it comes to drafting forwards..it's been abysmal. Aside from Parise, you could go back 10 years and the majority of the forwards they've drafted are either no longer in the league or on other teams. In either case, it doesn't help the Devils. I just think it's time for change with minds that bring a fresh approach.

 

I don't think  you move Lou upstairs, it would be a huge blow to his ego and he wouldn't be happy taking orders or ceding control to his replacement. Especially since he's been here 30+ years and considers himself the architect of the organization. The only way out of this is to thank him for all the years of service and kindly "ask" him to retire gracefully and hoping he accepts it.

 

The worst case scenario would be Lou refusing to retire, keeping Conte around, blowing the next two drafts, and keeping the roster intact, sans Zubrus and Salvador. I hope that won't be the case. 

[SterioDesign]

All you go on about is Zach Parise over and over again. You don't give a player coming off a major knee injury a longterm contract, nor do you trade a pending UFA when you are one of the best teams in the league during the 2nd half. 

 

You're being an ignorant right now. I didnt even brought up Zach. 

 

And look at what the Rangers did. They traded their captain and almost traded Zucc before the trade deadline cause thats what you have to do. 

 

blindly saying, "you simply don't do this!" is really really dumb. Cause 1- if you have to do it for the best of the team, you do it. 2- You try to put yourself in a situation where you won't have to make that decision.

['7']

Lou is not getting kicked upstairs unless he decides he doesn't have the energy anymore and wants to pare down his involvement. His ego is too big to be told to resign and then be given some ceremonial position. If it comes to that...he'll walk.

 

If Marty wants to go pay his dues in the minors for 5-6 years, go scout in Europe, go get into the nitty gritty of contract negotiations, really learn the management side of the game, sure I'd be willing to consider him in a top managerial role. But not straight off the ice. You know the Rangers were right to not just hand a coaching gig to Messier because he thought he was entitled to it and 1994 blah blah blah. You have to earn your way to the GM position.

 

I don't think he's in *much* danger for next year even if they miss. The finances are turning around, ticket sales are good, and the new ownership is still being seduced by Lou's pedigree. Certain things are expected however, the teams needs to get younger, faster, and it needs to hit a home run in round 1. If we're competitive next year, and in the playoff hunt then Lou is back for 16-17

Edited April 10, 2015 by '7'

[Jerzey]

We can argue all day about whether or not you trade pending free agents but the reality is when you don't either lock them up or trade them you run the risk of losing them and having to patch your lineup up with aging free agents. That's why we can trade away a 43 year old and a 39 year old and still have one of the oldest rosters in the league.

[thecoffeecake]

I'm honestly not on one side or the other on this debate, but to think that the game has changed and Lou hasn't changed with it is an absurd notion. If you and I, people who have simply watched or played the game, can understand the style of play in the NHL has changed, Lou certainly has. It doesn't matter how old he is. He's watching the same game you and I are. He's watching the same styles win the cup every year as you and I are. And he's not the one making passing observations and posting them to a forum. He's a professional. He's totally immersed in the game 24/7/365. What GM wasn't in hockey in some fashion or another when the game was so drastically different than it was today? We made a cup run 3 years ago playing one of the most aggressive forechecking styles in the league, and some of you are going to say he doesn't understand how to adapt to different styles of hockey.

Again, i'm not trying to defend him. I'm also not going to bash the guy for not being able to lure every top 5 free agents every summer, because some people here just assume because their contract is up, destiny has put them in a devils uniform. He's competing with 29 other GMs and franchises and cities.

[DevsMan84]

How did those moves set back the organization in any way?

 

What is wrong with Lou's influence? Explain further, and if your answer is that he missed the playoffs the last 3 years, I will rightly laugh at you.

 

They didn't set the organization back, but they didn't do anything to move it forward.  These were more "what the hell" signings that Lou pulled off of former Devils players.  I am not going to count moves that are basically tires spinning in the mud as successes.

 

My main point though is that these signings are not creative and they are at least seemingly becoming more and more common in these last few years.  Havlat and Ryder are similar to them but lack the Devils re-tread theme.  I know they were low risk/high reward but these like the Devils retreads show a bit of a lack of creativity.  I am done with putting in stop-gap fixes when Lou should have been starting to get long-term solutions at least 2 years ago.  Schneider is one step in the right direction at the very least and signing some of the more productive players to long-term contracts is another.

[jerseysteve]

This type of thread has popped up in a few different areas, and I keep saying the same thing:  Unless you can name a successor who improves our organization, then don't write how we need to get rid of him.  Keep in mind the challenges he was saddled with the last few years.  This organization was on the verge of bankruptcy.  Parise even stated that the financial state of the Devs played a part in his decision.  It wasn't too long ago that we were in the finals, and please don't make bs excuses about how that was a fluke.  It is what it is, and it was what it was.  Further, consider if you will, the completely unfair penalty we paid for signing Kovy.  There were several players throughout the league signed to similiar deals, but only Jersey was penalized.  That cost us a top 10 pick.  But you know what, this could be a blessing in disguise.  We have a new goal tending tandem that is arguably among the best in the league---when losing Marty, did you expect such a seamless transition or were you one of those screaming because we didn't re-sign Marty?  Our defense is young---YOUNG and good.  With Scott Stevens' tuteledge, the sky's the limit.  Now we have to address offense.  We'll certainly have cap space, although the FA market is slim pickings.  We do have great defensive depth, and that will help land a forward or two, and then nthe draft.  Finally, to the person who posted Glen Sather's name in the conversation...you've got to be kidding.  How long has it taken to get where they are today?  Let's not lose sight that as good as they look now, they still haven't won a thing since '94.  Is THAT the "success" you want???

[Louismydad]

This type of thread has popped up in a few different areas, and I keep saying the same thing: Unless you can name a successor who improves our organization, then don't write how we need to get rid of him. Keep in mind the challenges he was saddled with the last few years. This organization was on the verge of bankruptcy. Parise even stated that the financial state of the Devs played a part in his decision. It wasn't too long ago that we were in the finals, and please don't make bs excuses about how that was a fluke. It is what it is, and it was what it was. Further, consider if you will, the completely unfair penalty we paid for signing Kovy. There were several players throughout the league signed to similiar deals, but only Jersey was penalized. That cost us a top 10 pick. But you know what, this could be a blessing in disguise. We have a new goal tending tandem that is arguably among the best in the league---when losing Marty, did you expect such a seamless transition or were you one of those screaming because we didn't re-sign Marty? Our defense is young---YOUNG and good. With Scott Stevens' tuteledge, the sky's the limit. Now we have to address offense. We'll certainly have cap space, although the FA market is slim pickings. We do have great defensive depth, and that will help land a forward or two, and then nthe draft. Finally, to the person who posted Glen Sather's name in the conversation...you've got to be kidding. How long has it taken to get where they are today? Let's not lose sight that as good as they look now, they still haven't won a thing since '94. Is THAT the "success" you want???

This ^^

[Triumph]

This type of thread has popped up in a few different areas, and I keep saying the same thing:  Unless you can name a successor who improves our organization, then don't write how we need to get rid of him.  Keep in mind the challenges he was saddled with the last few years.  This organization was on the verge of bankruptcy.  Parise even stated that the financial state of the Devs played a part in his decision.  It wasn't too long ago that we were in the finals, and please don't make bs excuses about how that was a fluke.  It is what it is, and it was what it was.  Further, consider if you will, the completely unfair penalty we paid for signing Kovy.  There were several players throughout the league signed to similiar deals, but only Jersey was penalized.  That cost us a top 10 pick.  But you know what, this could be a blessing in disguise.  We have a new goal tending tandem that is arguably among the best in the league---when losing Marty, did you expect such a seamless transition or were you one of those screaming because we didn't re-sign Marty?  Our defense is young---YOUNG and good.  With Scott Stevens' tuteledge, the sky's the limit.  Now we have to address offense.  We'll certainly have cap space, although the FA market is slim pickings.  We do have great defensive depth, and that will help land a forward or two, and then nthe draft.  Finally, to the person who posted Glen Sather's name in the conversation...you've got to be kidding.  How long has it taken to get where they are today?  Let's not lose sight that as good as they look now, they still haven't won a thing since '94.  Is THAT the "success" you want???

 

I'm not hiring GMs, so that's moot.  This is an extremely important summer for the Devils.  They have a high pick - either a 1st overall, 6th overall, or 7th overall.  They have a young defense.  They have a TERRIBLE forward corps - besides Cammalleri, it's almost expansion-team bad, and there don't look to be improvements on the horizon.  All of which is a way of saying that doing basically nothing and letting the team have another bad season is probably preferable to doing a lot - the Devils can't get into long-term contract commitments to average players on the UFA market.  They shouldn't sign Antoine Vermette, or even think about it.  They shouldn't sign Justin Williams, or even think about it.  These are moves that will not only not help this team substantially, they will detract from it - by adding salary commitments to when the Devils need to pay people like Damon Severson big money, they will impact their future team negatively for a weak short-term gain.  If they have a 6th or 7th overall pick, that player should not play in the NHL next year, regardless of how good he does in training camp.  These are simple things which will help the Devils 2-3 years down the road which should be the focus of the franchise at this point.  Making the playoffs in 2017 while hanging on to their 1st round picks in 2015 and 2016 should be the goal.  Any move that detracts from that is bad, and I could see a lot of possible moves that do that.  If the Devils can hire a GM who will not look for short-term solutions, then that guy is better than a Lou who signs Antoine Vermette.

Edited April 10, 2015 by Triumph

[MadDog2020]

I'm not hiring GMs, so that's moot. This is an extremely important summer for the Devils. They have a high pick - either a 1st overall, 6th overall, or 7th overall. They have a young defense. They have a TERRIBLE forward corps - besides Cammalleri, it's almost expansion-team bad, and there don't look to be improvements on the horizon. All of which is a way of saying that doing basically nothing and letting the team have another bad season is probably preferable to doing a lot - the Devils can't get into long-term contract commitments to average players on the UFA market. They shouldn't sign Antoine Vermette, or even think about it. They shouldn't sign Justin Williams, or even think about it. These are moves that will not only not help this team substantially, they will detract from it - by adding salary commitments to when the Devils need to pay people like Damon Severson big money, they will impact their future team negatively for a weak short-term gain. If they have a 6th or 7th overall pick, that player should not play in the NHL next year, regardless of how good he does in training camp. These are simple things which will help the Devils 2-3 years down the road which should be the focus of the franchise at this point. Making the playoffs in 2017 while hanging on to their 1st round picks in 2015 and 2016 should be the goal. Any move that detracts from that is bad, and I could see a lot of possible moves that do that. If the Devils can hire a GM who will not look for short-term solutions, then that guy is better than a Lou who signs Antoine Vermette.

[devilsrule33]

I'm not hiring GMs, so that's moot.  This is an extremely important summer for the Devils.  They have a high pick - either a 1st overall, 6th overall, or 7th overall.  They have a young defense.  They have a TERRIBLE forward corps - besides Cammalleri, it's almost expansion-team bad, and there don't look to be improvements on the horizon.  All of which is a way of saying that doing basically nothing and letting the team have another bad season is probably preferable to doing a lot - the Devils can't get into long-term contract commitments to average players on the UFA market.  They shouldn't sign Antoine Vermette, or even think about it.  They shouldn't sign Justin Williams, or even think about it.  These are moves that will not only not help this team substantially, they will detract from it - by adding salary commitments to when the Devils need to pay people like Damon Severson big money, they will impact their future team negatively for a weak short-term gain.  If they have a 6th or 7th overall pick, that player should not play in the NHL next year, regardless of how good he does in training camp.  These are simple things which will help the Devils 2-3 years down the road which should be the focus of the franchise at this point.  Making the playoffs in 2017 while hanging on to their 1st round picks in 2015 and 2016 should be the goal.  Any move that detracts from that is bad, and I could see a lot of possible moves that do that.  If the Devils can hire a GM who will not look for short-term solutions, then that guy is better than a Lou who signs Antoine Vermette.

 

Yes, Yes and more Yes.

 

And as I have said all along, I don't think Lou will go down that path and that's the huge problem right now. 

 

There's just no out unless Lou decides to retire, and even he'd feel bad about putting the organization in a tough spot. The owners can't just fire Lou right now with no successor out there. If they wanted to feel out potential candidates, there is absolutely no way it could be done without Lou knowing about it with the respect he has around the NHL.

 

There is only bad that can come out of this off-season I'm afraid. I'll say it again for dramatic purposes: only bad.

[Neb00rs]

I'm not hiring GMs, so that's moot.  This is an extremely important summer for the Devils.  They have a high pick - either a 1st overall, 6th overall, or 7th overall.  They have a young defense.  They have a TERRIBLE forward corps - besides Cammalleri, it's almost expansion-team bad, and there don't look to be improvements on the horizon.  All of which is a way of saying that doing basically nothing and letting the team have another bad season is probably preferable to doing a lot - the Devils can't get into long-term contract commitments to average players on the UFA market.  They shouldn't sign Antoine Vermette, or even think about it.  They shouldn't sign Justin Williams, or even think about it.  These are moves that will not only not help this team substantially, they will detract from it - by adding salary commitments to when the Devils need to pay people like Damon Severson big money, they will impact their future team negatively for a weak short-term gain.  If they have a 6th or 7th overall pick, that player should not play in the NHL next year, regardless of how good he does in training camp.  These are simple things which will help the Devils 2-3 years down the road which should be the focus of the franchise at this point.  Making the playoffs in 2017 while hanging on to their 1st round picks in 2015 and 2016 should be the goal.  Any move that detracts from that is bad, and I could see a lot of possible moves that do that.  If the Devils can hire a GM who will not look for short-term solutions, then that guy is better than a Lou who signs Antoine Vermette.

 

Though I am in the leeway-for-Lou camp still (to a certain extent), this is an excellent post Triumph. As far as what the Devils need to do going forward, this is on the money.

[jagknife]

If it were my call, Lou gets the draft and a week or two into July to prove to me he isn't trying to patch work a fringe team with 35+ year old, last leg vets and going for ex-Devil retreads.

 

I wanted him gone most of this season, but as Tri has emphatically tried to get me to understand in multiple threads, he can still do work. Problem for me still remains though that I have very little confidence in the GM left, regardless of the Finals appearance in 2012. Yes, no one could predict the Parise or the Red Traitor, but it was the lack of effective management to plug those leaks in any fashion other than the "hey lets see if this former great has anything left in the tank" or "will this fringe player stick with our core"

 

We need to build for the future and we need to stop with the aging veterans wishing well.

 

Hopefully, Uncle Fester gets a bolt of lightning to the dome and starts going that way this summer instead of repeating the same, tired, failing concept three years running.

[Daniel]

I'm not hiring GMs, so that's moot.  This is an extremely important summer for the Devils.  They have a high pick - either a 1st overall, 6th overall, or 7th overall.  They have a young defense.  They have a TERRIBLE forward corps - besides Cammalleri, it's almost expansion-team bad, and there don't look to be improvements on the horizon.  All of which is a way of saying that doing basically nothing and letting the team have another bad season is probably preferable to doing a lot - the Devils can't get into long-term contract commitments to average players on the UFA market.  They shouldn't sign Antoine Vermette, or even think about it.  They shouldn't sign Justin Williams, or even think about it.  These are moves that will not only not help this team substantially, they will detract from it - by adding salary commitments to when the Devils need to pay people like Damon Severson big money, they will impact their future team negatively for a weak short-term gain.  If they have a 6th or 7th overall pick, that player should not play in the NHL next year, regardless of how good he does in training camp.  These are simple things which will help the Devils 2-3 years down the road which should be the focus of the franchise at this point.  Making the playoffs in 2017 while hanging on to their 1st round picks in 2015 and 2016 should be the goal.  Any move that detracts from that is bad, and I could see a lot of possible moves that do that.  If the Devils can hire a GM who will not look for short-term solutions, then that guy is better than a Lou who signs Antoine Vermette.

 

The one thing you're leaving out is that the team should continue to have excellent goaltending, which might be a little better with a plausible backup to start the season so that Schneider is not starting the first 20 or so games.  I don't know if this, and the belief that Larsson and Severson should only get better, leads Lou to conclude that all he needs to do is squeeze a little more offense out of the forwards, and sign the types of players you're talking about.  I don't think that would be the calamity you're making it out to be, by the way.  I'm not really worried about the money.  Even with a two or three grossly overpaid forwards, there should be plenty to lock up players like Severson and Larsson for the long term (Severson is basically getting the league minimum for the next two years).  My big fear is that the Devils continue to be one of those teams that's in that zone where they're always picking 8-12.  Just seems that often turns into a hole that's difficult to get out of. 

Edited April 10, 2015 by Daniel

[SterioDesign]

I often said im 100% supporting the way Shero does things and would want him here. He proved he can make the right decisions at the right time. Thats really all i want to see. 

 

And well he lost his job for not winning the cup basically and his team was a powerhouse during the season. Some will always point out that he was handed Crosby and Malkin bla bla bla, sure but it's also not that easy when you have 2 guys taking that much cap room and have to have depth around them. 

 

He also gathered a pretty good group of young dmen

Edited April 10, 2015 by SterioDesign

[slasher72]

Hopefully, Uncle Fester gets a bolt of lightning to the dome.

 

hahah. F'in sweet.

 

Like Jag and everyone else here, I'm done with the ex-Devils merry-go-round. Enough of that crap. I know Johnny Oduya is a possibility and while still a decent player I really don't want him here, for that fact alone. This organization needs a shot in the arm.  At 72 years old, I fear Lou is too stuck in his way to change and we'll see more of the same this offseason and next year. As a Giants fan, this mimics the 90's with George Young. His ego was huge, he was stubborn, ran the organization like he had zero accountability and answered to no one except himself, kept mediocre staff and players around way too long, and had clearly lost a few steps because he was married to his way of doing things and wouldn't accept any other approach.

[SterioDesign]

hahah. F'in sweet.

 

Like Jag and everyone else here, I'm done with the ex-Devils merry-go-round. Enough of that crap. I know Johnny Oduya is a possibility and while still a decent player I really don't want him here, for that fact alone. This organization needs a shot in the arm.  At 72 years old, I fear Lou is too stuck in his way to change and we'll see more of the same this offseason and next year. As a Giants fan, this mimics the 90's with George Young. His ego was huge, he was stubborn, ran the organization like he had zero accountability and answered to no one except himself, kept mediocre staff and players around way too long, and had clearly lost a few steps because he was married to his way of doing things and wouldn't accept any other approach.

 

Well you just described Lou right there lol 

 

He refused to admit his team was clearly nose diving and didnt do the right moves. Kept trying to do patching work to "remain competitive" which was ridiculous. We had no shot at the cup.

Edited April 10, 2015 by SterioDesign

[Daniel]

I often said im 100% supporting the way Shero does things and would want him here. He proved he can make the right decisions at the right time. Thats really all i want to see. 

 

And well he lost his job for not winning the cup basically and his team was a powerhouse during the season. Some will always point out that he was handed Crosby and Malkin bla bla bla, sure but it's also not that easy when you have 2 guys taking that much cap room and have to have depth around them. 

 

He also gathered a pretty good group of young dmen

 

The Penguins firing Shero will probably turn out to be one of the dumbest moves ever. 

[SterioDesign]

The Penguins firing Shero will probably turn out to be one of the dumbest moves ever. 

 

The players failed him but on paper, everything he did was what he had to do to win. 

[devilsrule33]

The Penguins firing Shero will probably turn out to be one of the dumbest moves ever. 

 

Or maybe the Penguins are feeling the affects of a mediocre job he's done for a decade. The Penguins drafted 1, 2, 1, 3, with 2nd and 3rd picks being generational talents. The fact that they are barely going to make the playoffs 10 months from his firing won't make it the dumbest move ever.

 

Now the hiring of Rutherford...