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DeBoer "Firing Watch" Thread


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I think a change is need and for the best of the organization. 

 

Our vets would play and produce the same with any coaches im sure while some of our kids will never have success with DeBoer.

 

eventhough our core is the vets i still think we should put more into our younsters and give them anything they'd need to be part of the future.

 

I know you don't want to read this, but the kids are having success. It's one of the few bright spots this season, actually. Severson is averaging 22 minutes a game now and 2nd on the team in PP time, while Merrill is getting 20 and over 2 mins on the PK per game. Gelinas is playing less than them, but that's because he's a disaster on defense. I'd like to see Larsson get more games. Also, Josefson was out there killing penalties. A coach will only have you doing that if he trusts you. I would have liked Boucher to get some more ice time when the game was out of reach last night. 

 

I think we also see Kinkaid by next month. Clem is bringing nothing. 

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Found the quotes:

WHOLEY UNDERWEAR!  Are you trying to deflect from your inane fire Hugh thread or what?   His system isn't a system -- it's bullsh!t.  It does not deserve the honor of being called a system.   ---- T

Sure, go ahead, bring up his 3 years in Florida.  You can bring them up all you like.  The problem for you guys is that you can't just say 'He didn't make the playoffs in Florida, therefore he's no go

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The stuff I am reading in this thread is shocking. DeBoer has no system? If anything he is too wedded to his system.

 

The thing is that I don't think the Devils have ever started seasons particularly well under DeBoer.  In 2011-12 they were terrible and I've been over that a hundred times so I don't really need to say it again.  In 2012-13 they had a good record but that was being masked by good goaltending and timely scoring - both of those went away by the end of the season but the system was strong.  And we all know the issues last year and that both Clowe and Jagr got off to rough starts before figuring things out.  So I'm not that concerned by this start because I've seen it before - the question is can the Devils make up for this later in the year, and I certainly think so, especially considering that they are not behind any of the playoff teams yet.  That's why this firing stuff is insane - Schneider's got a .901 SV% and the Devils have won 4 games this month.  The offense isn't going to sustain its pace but neither will Schneider.

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The stuff I am reading in this thread is shocking. DeBoer has no system? If anything he is too wedded to his system.

 

This, a million times.

 

First period and a half of last night are DeBoer's low event frustrating (to Pens fans) system. 

 

Second period and a half are a complete departure from that. Coach's job moving forward is to keep their concentration on the system in tact over the course of the game, simple as that. The way we beat quick Ottawa and Tampa Bay teams so far is the textbook on how we were supposed to beat the Penguins last night and the players just completely lost it.

Edited by DJ Eco
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The stuff I am reading in this thread is shocking. DeBoer has no system? If anything he is too wedded to his system.

WHOLEY UNDERWEAR!  Are you trying to deflect from your inane fire Hugh thread or what?

 

His system isn't a system -- it's bullsh!t.  It does not deserve the honor of being called a system.   ---- That was the whole freaking point!  Re-read this thread and comprehend what you're reading.  or print up some Drive out Hugh shirts - whatever floats your boat.

 

 

EDIT:

Oh jeesh... Well -- even with Tri and Eco's posts my point still stands.  DeBoer's system if you insist on calling it that - is not a winning system.  it's also extremely static. 

 

The Ineffable System  - built around the game of hockey - the never changing premise of hockey - it withstands all styles therein.  There are a few key points, around which there are mutable points. A system that allows for mutable points is the key to success. 

 

DeBoer's so called system has static unchanging points which result in static unchanging outcomes regardless of given circumstance. Blown leads for example.  I dont like to call it a system because it goes against all this is the former Devils System - which I love honor and respect to the ends of the hockey universe. 

 

and I'm not calling for his head -- I just want him to fvcking USE HIS!@  he's a damned stubborn fool OBVIOUSLY.

Edited by Pepperkorn
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WHOLEY UNDERWEAR!  Are you trying to deflect from your inane fire Hugh thread or what?

 

His system isn't a system -- it's bullsh!t.  It does not deserve the honor of being called a system.   ---- That was the whole freaking point!  Re-read this thread and comprehend what you're reading.  or print up some Drive out Hugh shirts - whatever floats your boat.

 

 

EDIT:

Oh jeesh... Well -- even with Tri and Eco's posts my point still stands.  DeBoer's system if you insist on calling it that - is not a winning system.  it's also extremely static. 

 

The Ineffable System  - built around the game of hockey - the never changing premise of hockey - it withstands all styles therein.  There are a few key points, around which there are mutable points. A system that allows for mutable points is the key to success. 

 

DeBoer's so called system has static unchanging points which result in static unchanging outcomes regardless of given circumstance. Blown leads for example.  I dont like to call it a system because it goes against all this is the former Devils System - which I love honor and respect to the ends of the hockey universe. 

 

and I'm not calling for his head -- I just want him to fvcking USE HIS!@  he's a damned stubborn fool OBVIOUSLY.

 

I'm curious to know what about it doesnt make it a system? From a tactical perspective.

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You need to be sectioned Pepperkorn.

At least she makes points rather than just whining that everyone else is wrong.

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If DeBoer gets canned, hire an interim and hope that Babcock doesn't get re-signed. I've always dreamed of having Mike Babcock behind the Devils' bench.

 

Same here. Oh man would he be a favorite around here.

..since the 2011-12 season, tell me.. how many steps forward has PD taken?

 

Well even if you're right (that he's taken steps back), you don't go out and hire Adam Oates, who took 10 steps back in his first stint as head coach and is currently unemployed, and say that's an upgrade.

 

That's like saying Carlo's Bakery is going down the tubes and making your birthday cake out of 7 Eleven donuts.

Edited by DJ Eco
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If DeBoer gets canned, hire an interim and hope that Babcock doesn't get re-signed. I've always dreamed of having Mike Babcock behind the Devils' bench.

 

I wonder if Babcock would ever be interested in moving up to GM. He'd be the perfect transition from Lou Lamoriello.

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You'll all nuts.  You're overreacting, and acting like the first 10 games are going to reflect the teams next 72.   Things can change pretty quickly and no one is happy after an 8-3 loss.  The rest of our division is fairly weak.  The comments in this thread make it seem like you think Lou doesn't watch the games.  Give me a break.

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You'll all nuts.  You're overreacting, and acting like the first 10 games are going to reflect the teams next 72.   Things can change pretty quickly and no one is happy after an 8-3 loss.  The rest of our division is fairly weak.  The comments in this thread make it seem like you think Lou doesn't watch the games.  Give me a break.

So I thought this would be a neat little math excursion. Your statement more or less checks out, especially over the last half dozen years there is very little correlation between how we start and finish.

A somewhat interesting note, a win tonight would essentially tie 2015 for our 3rd best start (point wise) since 2003, which one probably wouldn't assume based on a lot of this boards doom and gloom lately.

2015: 4-3-2 / 10 points / projected: 91.11 (based on 9 games thus far)

2014: 1-5-4  / 6 points  / projected:  49.2 / actual 88

2013: 6-1-3  / 15 points  / projected:  72 / actual 48 (48 game season)

2012: 4-5-1  / 9 points  / projected:  73.8 / actual 102

2011: 2-7-1  / 5 points  / projected:  41 / actual 81

2010: 6-4-0 / 12 points  / projected:  98.4 / actual 103

2009: 6-2-2 / 14 points  / projected:  114.8 / actual 106

2008: 3-6-1 / 7 points  / projected:  57.4 / actual 99

2007: 5-4-1 / 11 points  / projected:  90.2 / actual 107

2006: 5-5-0 / 10 points  / projected:  82 / actual 101

2005: =[

2004: 5-3-2-0 / 12 points / projected:  98.4 / actual 100

2003: 7-3-0-0 / 14 points / projected:  114.8 / actual 108

2002: 6-3-0-1 / 13 points / projected:  106.6 / actual 95

2001: 6-2-2-0 / 14 points / projected:  114.8 / actual 111

2000: 6-2-1-1 / 14 points / projected:  114.8 / actual 103

1999: 6-4-0 / 12 points / projected:  98.4 / actual 105

1998: 6-4-0 / 12 points / projected:  98.4 / actual 107

Edit: some other interesting notes between 98 and 2004 our average initial 10 game point totals was exactly 13, and we never deviated by more then +/-1 point. 

After the lockout (not including 2015) our average was 9.8 and deviations of -4.8 and +5.2. I don't think there is any predictive power there, but we have had much more erratic starts in the salary cap era (I imagine the same is true for the other 29 teams as well).

Pre lockout the 10 initial game projection average was 106.6, and the actual total points average was 104.14

Post lockout the 10 initial game projection average was 81.01 and the actual total points average was 95.87 (* i projected 2013 point totals proportionally to a full 82 game season)

 

Edited by squishyx
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You'll all nuts. You're overreacting, and acting like the first 10 games are going to reflect the teams next 72. Things can change pretty quickly and no one is happy after an 8-3 loss. The rest of our division is fairly weak. The comments in this thread make it seem like you think Lou doesn't watch the games. Give me a break.

People are not basing the Pete stuff on only nine games this year.

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Why have a special thread for this? You people talk about it on every thread anyway.

We got 10 out of 18 points with the oldest team in the league. Jesus we lost 3 games in a row and you'd think we were the Carolina Hurricanes. This forum has just turned into gionta/deboer bickering.

You'll all nuts. You're overreacting, and acting like the first 10 games are going to reflect the teams next 72. Things can change pretty quickly and no one is happy after an 8-3 loss. The rest of our division is fairly weak. The comments in this thread make it seem like you think Lou doesn't watch the games. Give me a break.

Thank you.

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People are not basing the Pete stuff on only nine games this year.

 

whoa whoa.. careful now!!! We're not allowed to bring up his 3 years in Florida......... or last season either!! (after all, poor Pete had so much to deal with the Brodeur\Schneider drama) Can't bring up what's happened thus-far.. this season just started after all. Can't look @ 2013 either!!!! That was a half-a-season lockout year, and should absolutely be stricken from the record.

All we will focus on his 2012. The wonderful, lovely, magnificent SCF run in 2012. Everything else with DeBoer doesn't matter as a Head Coach.. just 2012. Doesn't matter that this is his 7th year of exp. on the job.. 2012 should be the only season that gets glorified! :thumbsup:

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comments in this thread make it seem like you think Lou doesn't watch the games.  Give me a break.

no doubt. but ur still talking about a gm that is very sentimental and fond of players coaches that have had success here. i think lou is in debt to pdb for 2012, and i really cant see him firing him at all this season

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whoa whoa.. careful now!!! We're not allowed to bring up his 3 years in Florida......... or last season either!! (after all, poor Pete had so much to deal with the Brodeur\Schneider drama) Can't bring up what's happened thus-far.. this season just started after all. Can't look @ 2013 either!!!! That was a half-a-season lockout year, and should absolutely be stricken from the record.

All we will focus on his 2012. The wonderful, lovely, magnificent SCF run in 2012. Everything else with DeBoer doesn't matter as a Head Coach.. just 2012. Doesn't matter that this is his 7th year of exp. on the job.. 2012 should be the only season that gets glorified! :thumbsup:

 

Sure, go ahead, bring up his 3 years in Florida.  You can bring them up all you like.  The problem for you guys is that you can't just say 'He didn't make the playoffs in Florida, therefore he's no good' without sounding like an idiot.  Here is the team that came within one point of making the playoffs in 2008-09:

 

Stillman-Weiss-Horton

Booth-Frolik-Dvorak

Peltonen-Campbell-Zednik

McLean-Kreps-Stewart

 

Bouwmeester-Ballard

McCabe-Skrastins

Cullimore-Boynton

 

Vokoun

Anderson

 

Does this team look good to anyone?  Doesn't look good to me outside of the net.  In fact you have a ton of guys on this team who have looked worse elsewhere, although a lot of that's due to injury, but even the young players on this team have gone elsewhere and struggled.  And the teams just got worse from there.

 

On the final day of Deboer's Florida tenure, here is the lineup he put out there:

 

Booth-Weiss-Samsonov

Dadonov-Reasoner-Skille

Repik-Santorelli-Bergfors

Ti. Kennedy-Rissmiller-B. Thomas

 

Kulikov-Weaver

Ellerby-Garrison

C. Wilson-J. Callahan

 

Vokoun

 

This was in 2011.  Of this team, Garrison, Kulikov, Weaver, and Santorelli are the only NHL regulars left.  And that was 3 and a half years ago.

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People are not basing the Pete stuff on only nine games this year.

 

Sure they are.  Because the problems this year have not been the problems of years past.  The Devils have limited shots against to a ridiculous degree the last 2 seasons.  That's not been the case so far this year.  They also have had trouble scoring the last two years, and that has not been an issue this year either.   You can say 'blown leads' but I don't think that's a coaching thing and that's again having to do more with allowing that many shots.

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